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  1. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase View Post
    Yes, bravo, cynic and otg.

    Just...please tell me that the BPD and DAs, who spent $2 MILLION DOLLARS ON THIS CASE...had professionals actually do these experiments and know precisedly what caused this injury?

    Go ahead; lie to me.

    But this has me thinking: what if the flashlight was left on the counter ON PURPOSE. As a red herring?

    That would explain why the batteries were wiped down: if the Ramseys' fingerprints were on them, it couldn't have belonged to an intruder.

    So it was meant to confuse LE.

    And that's why Patsy claimed she didn't know it was theirs.

    Of course, it was always possible LE would figure out it belonged to the Ramseys, but maybe they were rolling the dice when they were staging, not knowing how all the many "clues" JR spoke about "left" by this clever creature would shake out, but hoping to confuse LE enough that the Ramseys could slide by.

    Which is exactly what happened.

    With help from Hunter and Lacy, of course.
    Confuse is the main word for sure, koldkase. Yea, I think that's the best motive for the fingerprintless (is that a word?) flashlight. I could just hear the defense if prosecution had done their job: "Now, why would my clients wipe down a flashlight if it were their own? Why, there fingerprints should've been on it!"

  2. #26
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    Default At last...

    I can now see that this is just a portion of JonBenet's skull, oriented toward the back, actually. All this time, I thought it was the TOP of her head, and that the blow had struck at the top REAR of her skull, but this is just the back section. Actually now it makes total sense to me that she died or was close to death quickly after she was struck; this is the most dangerous area to hit someone in.

    After my son fell off his skateboard, the pediatric neurologist who treated him said he was very lucky - that if he had fallen backward and hit his head, he would probably have died. As it was, he had a mild skull fracture and only lost his sense of smell (most of it), which is common with head injuries. Sometimes it returns, but many times, it does not.

    But JonBenet never had a chance of recovering, not with that blow to the back of her head.
    "We're not necessarily doubting that God will do the best for us; we are wondering how painful the best will turn out to be." - C.S. Lewis

    MY OPINIONS - DO NOT COPY THEM ANYWHERE ELSE ON THE INTERNET!

  3. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase View Post
    Did y'all do this already?

    I'm sure cynic can lay the actual photo over the graphic.... Me, I'm on vacay....

    I hate to disturb you, KK, if you were having a good rest. But since you posted the above side-by-side, I will point out something that confirms that we have the position of the depressed fracture correct. Just something for you and everyone else to ponder while I catch up on "real life" for a bit.

    It is not as noticeable in the skull photo as it is in the alleged X-ray of her skull, but there is a small crack coming from the oval shape on the upper left portion (as the above photo is oriented). Dr. Meyer addresses it in this portion of the AR:
    The hemorrhage and the fracture extend posteriorly just past the midline of the occipital area of the skull.
    I believe here he is describing that small linear crack that appears to come away from the depressed fracture and begins going off to the left-hand side of her skull. You can see this small crack best in the photo that is supposedly of the X-ray of her skull.

    Actually, I believe the linear crack here is following the suture line of the lambdoid suture, and that there may be a suture bone there as well. (I don't remember if I mentioned suture bones here before, or it it was at WS. They're also called Wormian bones after the physician who defined them.) If it's true that this linear portion of the crack is indeed following a suture, then by definition, it is a diastatic fracture. In fact, I'm not certain that the rest of the linear fracture is not somewhat (at least partly) following along the sagittal suture. I'm basing this on where we see in the picture that the fracture goes toward the front of the skull.

    There is much more about the skull that is worth discussing that I'll post later. Some of it, I really don't understand myself, so I'm hoping to get feedback on what it means. Think... Symmetry.

  4. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by otg View Post
    I hate to disturb you, KK, if you were having a good rest. But since you posted the above side-by-side, I will point out something that confirms that we have the position of the depressed fracture correct. Just something for you and everyone else to ponder while I catch up on "real life" for a bit.

    It is not as noticeable in the skull photo as it is in the alleged X-ray of her skull, but there is a small crack coming from the oval shape on the upper left portion (as the above photo is oriented). Dr. Meyer addresses it in this portion of the AR:

    I believe here he is describing that small linear crack that appears to come away from the depressed fracture and begins going off to the left-hand side of her skull. You can see this small crack best in the photo that is supposedly of the X-ray of her skull.

    Actually, I believe the linear crack here is following the suture line of the lambdoid suture, and that there may be a suture bone there as well. (I don't remember if I mentioned suture bones here before, or it it was at WS. They're also called Wormian bones after the physician who defined them.) If it's true that this linear portion of the crack is indeed following a suture, then by definition, it is a diastatic fracture. In fact, I'm not certain that the rest of the linear fracture is not somewhat (at least partly) following along the sagittal suture. I'm basing this on where we see in the picture that the fracture goes toward the front of the skull.

    There is much more about the skull that is worth discussing that I'll post later. Some of it, I really don't understand myself, so I'm hoping to get feedback on what it means. Think... Symmetry.
    Wormian? Oh, what an unfortunate name....

    I did notice that little "wormian" looking, squiggly fracture radiating from the main of the "rectangular" section. It looks like something punched through there.

    There's also a small section that looks like it's hanging loosely on the opposite, right edge of the rectangular comminuted fracture.

    It will be interesting to hear your thoughts on the "symmetry" you mention, when you have a chance. I, however, am way out of my depth on this topic--it's Latin to me; so I'll leave it to you and the medically inclined here.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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  5. #29

    Default Prior blow with a golf club delivered by Burke

    If memory serves, Burke had hit JonBenet's head with a golf club one or two years before. I recall reading somewhere that Patsy was concerned that JonBenet's face might retain scars from the injury, and that she consulted a plastic surgeon about it.

  6. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by rashomon View Post
    If memory serves, Burke had hit JonBenet's head with a golf club one or two years before. I recall reading somewhere that Patsy was concerned that JonBenet's face might retain scars from the injury, and that she consulted a plastic surgeon about it.
    Yes, Patsy said that JonBenet had walked behind Burke as he was hitting practice golf balls in the yard in Charlevoix. It sounds innocent enough, but the reality may be something quite different.
    "We're not necessarily doubting that God will do the best for us; we are wondering how painful the best will turn out to be." - C.S. Lewis

    MY OPINIONS - DO NOT COPY THEM ANYWHERE ELSE ON THE INTERNET!

  7. #31

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    I found a brilliant website explaining blunt force trauma in a way which even I can understand.

    It also explains some things you've mentioned about your son's head injuries, heymom.

    Included are descriptions of damage caused by various objects impacting on various surfaces:

    http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1680107-overview

    Forensic Autopsy of Blunt Force Trauma
    Author: Nicholas I Batalis, MD; Chief Editor: Stephen J Cina, MD, FCAP

    [snip]

    This chapter focuses on the cutaneous manifestations of blunt force injury. Other chapters will expand on topics such as closed head injuries, including sequelae of rapid acceleration/deceleration.

    Overview of the entity

    The severity of injuries inflicted as a result of blunt force trauma is dependent on the amount of kinetic energy transferred and the tissue to which the energy is transferred. The kinetic energy associated with a moving object is equal to one half the mass of that object multiplied by the velocity of the object squared (1/2 mv2). In general, a somewhat lighter object traveling at high speed will cause more damage than a heavier object traveling at low speed.[1, 2, 3, 4]

    Equally important, however, are the characteristics of the blunt object and the surface that is impacted. Impacts involving a large surface area -- either with regard to the impacting object or with regard to the tissues being impacted -- will result in a greater dispersion of energy over a larger area and less injury to the impacted tissues. For example, a thin metal pipe striking some part of the body would be expected to inflict greater localized injuries than a broad board of similar mass and velocity striking the same part of the body. Likewise, an impact on a small area of a curved surface, such as the head, will cause greater damage than would be caused were that same impact to occur on a flat surface, such as the back, since there will be a more concentrated point of impact on the head.

    The composition, or plasticity, of the tissues impacted also affects the resultant injuries. For example, a person who is kicked in the chest may have only minimal injuries to the elastic skin surface, whereas deeper, more solid tissues such as ribs and internal organs (notably, the spleen and liver) may experience fractures and lacerations.

    Yet another factor affecting the severity of blunt force injuries is the amount of time the body and the impacting object are in contact. A longer period of contact allows kinetic energy to be dissipated over a prolonged period, resulting in less damage to the tissues than an equally forceful impact with dispersion of energy over a brief period.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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    3 Dimensional

    ~~~~~~
    My opinions, nothing more.

  8. #32

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    And for those who are as challenged as I in reading this stuff, like the autopsy language, here's a short and informative section about forensic neuropathology--stuff about brain injuries:

    http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1680207-overview

    And this link is specifically to definitions of terms used in describing the brain injuries which are in the autopsy. I intend to look at that more carefully with these in hand:


    http://emedicine.medscape.com/articl...view#aw2aab6b3

    BTW, I tried to go to another article at this site, and it is now asking me to log in or create a (free) account. Maybe you only get to see so many and then have to join? Sorry if that's the case. I don't mind joining, though, for free, but it is another hassle, so sorry about that if it's a problem for you.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

    ~~~~~~~
    Bloomies underwear model:
    3 Dimensional

    ~~~~~~
    My opinions, nothing more.

  9. #33
    BobC is offline Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript and Book Reviewer
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    Golf club.

  10. #34

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    Golf club.

    If the lantern end of the Maglite was used, the terrific force of the impact on JonBenet's skull would have smashed the light bulb and, most probably, the glass shield. As far as we know, there was NO damage found on the Maglite, not even a dent. For the head blow to have caused the hairline fracture and displacement of skull pieces, it would have to be brought down with a tremendous amount of violent energy. We're not talking about a bump on the head, or a bruise, or even a concussion. We're talking about splitting the skull, from the back, with JonBenet's head in a downward position.

    Furthermore, for the Maglite to have been used and have it fit the profile of the head wound, JonBenet would have had to be hit from the side, with her head down, and that is a very awkward position for the assailant to get any degree of leverage. Using physics, I believe we have already proved JonBenet was hit from behind and from above while her head was in a downward slant. In addition, the head wound does NOT match the half-moon design of the end of a flashlight but the more ovoid/rectangular head of a golf club.

    If the assailant hit JonBenet from behind with the Maglite, the indentation of the head injury would have been spread horizontally across the back of her skull, not vertically.

    The Maglite was most likely used to navigate the house, and write the ransom note, without turning on lights that would alert the neighbors. The fact that the Maglite and the batteries were wiped clean of fingerprints and placed prominently on the kitchen counter would give the impression the Ramseys planted it as a red herring to focus attention away from the true weapon, a golf club. This further confirmed by the Ramseys acting like they couldn't say if it was THEIR Maglite when they had one just like it. If they had one like it, then where was THEIR Maglite if the one on the kitchen counter WASN'T theirs?
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  11. #35

    Default Baseball bat, maybe?

    I have always been curious about the baseball bat which had been found outside, and which had fibers from the basement carpet on it.
    When confronted with a photo of the bat, Patsy pretended not to know whether it belonged to the Ramseys.
    But irrc, during the GJ hearings it turned out that the bat was Burke's.

  12. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by rashomon View Post
    I have always been curious about the baseball bat which had been found outside, and which had fibers from the basement carpet on it.
    When confronted with a photo of the bat, Patsy pretended not to know whether it belonged to the Ramseys.
    But irrc, during the GJ hearings it turned out that the bat was Burke's.
    I think a baseball bat would have left more of a half-circle, similar to what the Maglight would have left.
    "We're not necessarily doubting that God will do the best for us; we are wondering how painful the best will turn out to be." - C.S. Lewis

    MY OPINIONS - DO NOT COPY THEM ANYWHERE ELSE ON THE INTERNET!



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