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  1. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherokee View Post
    Yes, we have that photo.
    These are the two that I have.




  2. #38

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    I am in the camp that Jonbenet did indeed sleep in brother Burkes room on Christmas eve. She didn't wet the bed that night IMO because she is pictured on Christmas morning opening presents in the pink pjs. There were actually some posters here a while back who tried to convince me that Jonbenet had slept in her own bed on Christmas Eve, had wet it, and had changed into the clean pink pj's on Christmas morning. We were discussing when JB's sheets had last been changed. I didn't buy it then and I don't buy it now. She did not sleep in her bed Christmas Eve NOR did she ever make it to her bed Christmas night. IMO of course!!
    I only meantion that because this conversation about Burke wearing both top and bottoms dowstairs to open Christmas presents sounds like he had changed pjs for opening Christmas presents too lie some of the other posters insist JB did. So now we have BOTH the children changing into clean pjs christmas morning to come down and open Christmas presents? One because she peed in her pjs and one because he pooped in his?? That's entirely illogical, IMO.
    I can see the soiled pj bottoms playing out more like a practical joke by Burke. Like maybe he carried them in there to gross out Jonbenet instead of actually removing them in her room. I don't know. I surely can not explain the candy though.
    Let's not forget that MISS PATSY spent a good deal of time in Jonbenets room on Christmas DAY when she was arguing with JB over the red turtleneck top. If those stinky pjs and candy were in there wouldn't she smell them? Now the question is did she smell and see them and do nothing? I'm thinking that stuff probably wasn't there when Patsy was there during the day. It kind of almost proves to me what I've always thought about what happened Christmas night. Patsy never spent time in jbs room christmas night putting her to bed.

  3. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase View Post
    And wasn't there one version of what happened Christmas Day that had JB sick? Was that the former maid's story? Or was that the Ramsey's? Anyone remember that from one of the thousand sources?
    Q. (By Mr. Levin) It was brought to my attention fairly recently that a woman I believe named Jean Fortier, F-o-r-t-i-e-r, for the reporter, who are the parents of some children who were over your house on Christmas, and they, they, she, excuse me, said that her children reported to her at Christmas day when they went over to play, they played with Burke but that JonBenet did not play because she was sick. I hadn't heard that before. Is that nonsense?
    A. Absolutely. I don't know who that is, but we had a whole parcel of kids there all day.
    John Ramsey Interview, Atlanta, 2000

  4. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karen View Post
    I only meantion that because this conversation about Burke wearing both top and bottoms dowstairs to open Christmas presents sounds like he had changed pjs for opening Christmas presents too lie some of the other posters insist JB did. So now we have BOTH the children changing into clean pjs christmas morning to come down and open Christmas presents? One because she peed in her pjs and one because he pooped in his?? That's entirely illogical, IMO.
    I am not sure if you are referring to anything I said, but if you are, then there is a misunderstanding. I was not saying Burke changed PJs to go down and open Christmas presents. I was merely postulating reasons why only Burke's soiled PJ bottoms were in JonBenet's room, with no PJ top. I said perhaps Burke didn't usually sleep with a PJ top, but (was told to) put one on in order to open presents because photos would be taken of the event. It was merely speculation on my part about whether Burke usually wore a PJ top to bed or not. Just because he is seen in one for Christmas morning photos doesn't mean he always slept in one, but then again, he could have.

    To repeat, I do not believe Burke changed PJs to open Christmas presents, and I never said that, nor meant to imply that, from anything I wrote.

    It is possible Burke carried the soiled PJ bottoms, with enough excrement in them to smear on JonBenet's candy, into JonBenet's bedroom. It is true he did not have to be wearing them at the time.

  5. #41
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    keep in mind that the report said that these PJ bottoms were thought to belong to BR. They were never PROVEN to have been his, and the feces was not tested to determine who it belonged to.
    We know Patsy was a slob, but she had to have been in her daughter's room at some point Christmas Day before they went to the White's- I am sure she'd have had to supervise JB getting ready for the party. Even a slob like Patsy wouldn't wait 2 days for her housekeeper to come to pick up poop from a bedroom floor, in PJ or on a candy box. I feel this "deposit" was made that night AFTER they got home.
    This is my Constitutionally protected OPINION. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  6. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by cynic View Post
    Third question: Burke’s PJ bottoms on the floor in JonBenet’s bedrom, true?
    Answer – Yes.
    Just to be clear so there is not any confusion ... when I started the discussion about the PJ bottoms on this thread, I wasn't referring to any report but to the question asked of Kolar during Tricia's interview of him on December 23rd.

    Kolar was specifically asked if the soiled PJ bottoms on the floor of JonBenet's bedroom were Burke's, and he said they were.

    The difference in size between ten-year-old Burke and six-year-old JonBenet is evident in photos. He was head and shoulders taller than her, and I don't think his PJ bottoms could have been mistaken for JonBenet's. Obviously, in the cataloguing of items according to the investigation, the PJ bottoms were of sufficient length and size to be listed as Burke's clothing and not JonBenet's.

  7. #43

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    There is another possibility as to when the perpetrator of poop's pooped up pj's might have been placed in JonBenet's room (I don't think I've seen this speculated yet)... It could have been done on Boxing Day (along with the candy contamination) while all the commotion was going on downstairs and everyone thought that the dear little brother was sound asleep in his room.

    I'm just sayin'.....
    .
    All views expressed in my posts are my opinion and are protected under the First Amendment to the United States Constitution as “freedom of speech”.

  8. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karen View Post
    I am in the camp that Jonbenet did indeed sleep in brother Burkes room on Christmas eve. She didn't wet the bed that night IMO because she is pictured on Christmas morning opening presents in the pink pjs. There were actually some posters here a while back who tried to convince me that Jonbenet had slept in her own bed on Christmas Eve, had wet it, and had changed into the clean pink pj's on Christmas morning. We were discussing when JB's sheets had last been changed. I didn't buy it then and I don't buy it now. She did not sleep in her bed Christmas Eve NOR did she ever make it to her bed Christmas night. IMO of course!!
    I only meantion that because this conversation about Burke wearing both top and bottoms dowstairs to open Christmas presents sounds like he had changed pjs for opening Christmas presents too lie some of the other posters insist JB did. So now we have BOTH the children changing into clean pjs christmas morning to come down and open Christmas presents? One because she peed in her pjs and one because he pooped in his?? That's entirely illogical, IMO.
    I can see the soiled pj bottoms playing out more like a practical joke by Burke. Like maybe he carried them in there to gross out Jonbenet instead of actually removing them in her room. I don't know. I surely can not explain the candy though.
    Let's not forget that MISS PATSY spent a good deal of time in Jonbenets room on Christmas DAY when she was arguing with JB over the red turtleneck top. If those stinky pjs and candy were in there wouldn't she smell them? Now the question is did she smell and see them and do nothing? I'm thinking that stuff probably wasn't there when Patsy was there during the day. It kind of almost proves to me what I've always thought about what happened Christmas night. Patsy never spent time in jbs room christmas night putting her to bed.
    Oh gosh, I hope I wasn't beating you over the head with my seldom offered opinions... If it was me, mea culpa! If not, let's just pretend it was and give me 20 lashes, then move on....

    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee View Post
    keep in mind that the report said that these PJ bottoms were thought to belong to BR. They were never PROVEN to have been his, and the feces was not tested to determine who it belonged to.
    We know Patsy was a slob, but she had to have been in her daughter's room at some point Christmas Day before they went to the White's- I am sure she'd have had to supervise JB getting ready for the party. Even a slob like Patsy wouldn't wait 2 days for her housekeeper to come to pick up poop from a bedroom floor, in PJ or on a candy box. I feel this "deposit" was made that night AFTER they got home.
    Patsy said she played with JonBenet on Christmas Day, with her beading, I think. She also said JB played with her "loom," which was found in JB's bedroom. Patsy was home, preparing for the trip and upcoming pageant, as well, while John was at the airport.

    Children ran in and out of the house. I thought I once read they were in Burke's room playing, as well.

    I think it's a safe bet that Patsy was in that area of Burke's and JB's rooms, as the packing of the suitcases in JAR's bedroom was underway, for the Big Red Boat trip. Patsy spoke about that in the '97 interview with Thomas, I'm thinking...? John even mentioned JB's yellow swimsuit in one interview or book, though I can't remember which right now.

    Just some thoughts.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

    ~~~~~~~
    Bloomies underwear model:
    3 Dimensional

    ~~~~~~
    My opinions, nothing more.

  9. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by cynic View Post
    Q. (By Mr. Levin) It was brought to my attention fairly recently that a woman I believe named Jean Fortier, F-o-r-t-i-e-r, for the reporter, who are the parents of some children who were over your house on Christmas, and they, they, she, excuse me, said that her children reported to her at Christmas day when they went over to play, they played with Burke but that JonBenet did not play because she was sick. I hadn't heard that before. Is that nonsense?
    A. Absolutely. I don't know who that is, but we had a whole parcel of kids there all day.
    John Ramsey Interview, Atlanta, 2000
    Thanks for the photos.

    I'm not sure that this is the source to which I was referring, which may have been completely wrong. But it could have been the original source which ended up getting passed around on the forums as gossip before these transcripts became public, and possibly where the version of which I'm thinking originated.

    If that makes any sense AT ALL....

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

    ~~~~~~~
    Bloomies underwear model:
    3 Dimensional

    ~~~~~~
    My opinions, nothing more.

  10. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherokee View Post
    Just to be clear so there is not any confusion ... when I started the discussion about the PJ bottoms on this thread, I wasn't referring to any report but to the question asked of Kolar during Tricia's interview of him on December 23rd.

    Kolar was specifically asked if the soiled PJ bottoms on the floor of JonBenet's bedroom were Burke's, and he said they were.

    The difference in size between ten-year-old Burke and six-year-old JonBenet is evident in photos. He was head and shoulders taller than her, and I don't think his PJ bottoms could have been mistaken for JonBenet's. Obviously, in the cataloguing of items according to the investigation, the PJ bottoms were of sufficient length and size to be listed as Burke's clothing and not JonBenet's.
    I suppose there is slight degree of ambiguity in the Q and A, but given the context it's unlikely that the interpretation that they were Burke's pajama bottoms is incorrect.
    This is what was specifically said (beginning at around 62:20 into the show.)
    KoldKase: You did mention that there were pajama bottoms on the floor that were believed to be Burke’s and I’m assuming they were boy’s pajama bottoms on her bedroom floor.
    Jim Kolar: That was my interpretation of the reports that I read.
    KoldKase: OK…
    Tricia (party pooper) Griffith: Ok that’s it, you know what, KoldKase, I apologize, we’ll have to get to your 8 other questions next time...

  11. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by cynic View Post
    I suppose there is slight degree of ambiguity in the Q and A, but given the context it's unlikely that the interpretation that they were Burke's pajama bottoms is incorrect.
    This is what was specifically said (beginning at around 62:20 into the show.)
    KoldKase: You did mention that there were pajama bottoms on the floor that were believed to be Burke’s and I’m assuming they were boy’s pajama bottoms on her bedroom floor.
    Jim Kolar: That was my interpretation of the reports that I read.
    KoldKase: OK…
    Tricia (party pooper) Griffith: Ok that’s it, you know what, KoldKase, I apologize, we’ll have to get to your 8 other questions next time...
    Thank you, Cynic, for the clarification.

  12. #48

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    I'm sorry koldkase and Cherokee. I was just rambling on and on with my own thoughts, not really referring to your posts at all. Sometimes there is a disconnect between the brain and typing fingers and my posts don't come out the way I intended.
    That's the problem with message board posting. You can't hear voice inflection or daydream musing on the subject at hand.



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