Prosecute the JonBenet case! Help prove that money doesn't buy license to kill!

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by Tricia, Sep 18, 2003.

  1. Tricia

    Tricia Administrator Staff Member

    Appoint a Special Prosecutor in the JonBenet Murder Investigation.

    http://www.petitiononline.com/jbr246/petition.html

    1091. E Beck... Please prosecute the JonBenet case ... help prove that money doesn't buy license to kill.

    Please prosecute the JonBenet case ... help prove that money doesn't buy license to kill.

    Signature number 1091 says it all.

    The only way this case will be prosecuted is to appoint a special prosecutor.

    Please send out the petition link to your anyone who wants to help prove that money doesn't buy a license to kill.

    Tricia.
    http://www.petitiononline.com/jbr246/petition.html
     
  2. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    Isn't It Also Time?

    In recent postings by Candy at Cybersleuths, Gov. Owens has stated that he has no intention to get involved in this case unless there is "new evidence."

    Isn't it about time that Keenan is held publicly accountable for what, if anything, has been done on the case? Her office took over the investigation in December, 2002. In the last 10 months, all she has done is convene a panel to discuss the case and hire an investigator. But what actual work has been conducted?

    Filing the petition should be prefaced by a demand on Gov. Owens to hold Keenan publicly accountable for her responsibility by proving what, if anything, is being done to further investigate the case!
     
  3. Ilene-Sue

    Ilene-Sue Member

    Signature #1096
    As a resident of Boulder County, i feel that justice must be done. I also belive a full investigation into the actions of Alex Hunter must be done to get to the bottom of this shamless miscarriage of justice in the death of a child.

    This murder "uninvestigation" is a giant travesty of justice for JonBenet. I predict, that someday this case will be in the hands of competent, "cold case" investigators who will meticulously, seriously, solve this murder. NOT, I am sure, in the State of Colorado, where in my opinion, has been influenced by Lin Wood's biased threats.
     
  4. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    Dr. Henry Lee Agrees

    As I stated above, Keenan's "investigation" of the case should be held publicly accountable, not just Hunter's as signature #1096 states.

    http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/famous/ramsey/update_14.html?sect=7

    Exerpt from April, 2003 Court TV Article:

    Dr. [Henry] Lee had not been consulted by the new D.A. and he acknowledged that there "may be
    significant new evidence in the cases since his last involvement."

    If Dr. Lee believes there is "significant new evidence" which is what Gov. Owens demands before he becomes involved in the case again, why hasn't Keenan contacted him, and what is Owens waiting for?

    If CO officials won't do anything with this case other than bury it, why not turn it over to a cold case unit? Maybe we should all re-think the petition demand on Owens to appoint a special prosecutor. Maybe instead we should demand that he turn the case over to Vidoq or that new cold case unit that just met in Las Vegas.....
     
  5. AK

    AK Member

    DejaNu

    That's not how these things work. A cold case group cannot come into an investigation unless they're invited. And that's only done for cases that have been shelved. The Ramsey case is being actively worked. I think we should give Keenan and her team all the support they need to get the job done.

    Incidentally, Vidocq did present the case in an unofficial way at an annual banquet several years ago, and many members continue to monitor progress. This case, like the JFK assassination, offers endless intrigue to homicide professionals, and there are always two tracts of case-philes: those working officially and those hobbying or studying in an academic way. The heavy lifting is always done by the official experts, as the ARRB did in JFK.

    I don't want to see the Ramsey case prosecuted poorly, resulting in an acquittal. I'm in this for the long haul. Getting frustrated burns up useful energy -- better to focus on something other than conspiracy theories and red herrings. When this case heats up I will be front and center with all my wits about me ready to rock and roll. Until then there are scores of other cases, many much older than Ramsey.

    In the Brandi Conley case, there were two grand juries and almost seven years before her killer went to jail. Interestingly, the citizens who wanted to keep the case alive partnered with Parents of Murdered Children who put a petition on their web site. Then the DA asked a 'cold case' cop to review the file, he sought help from forensic experts and together they cracked the case. All of these elements are present in the Ramsey case, from a review of the case file, new experts consulted, and an Internet petition spawned by concerned observers.

    Patience is a good thing.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 20, 2003
  6. Spade

    Spade Member

    FedoraX

    Patience is a very good thing. Dr. Lee was refering to "possible new evidence" that he did NOT know anything about; not "new evidence" that he had knowledge of. Tom Haney, Mike Kane, Bruce Levin, Steve Thomas, or even John Douglas could have said the same thing.

    The idea that the investigation and/or the governor are being influenced by the threat of lawsuits from lw is ridiculous. If lw is half as smart as IMO he is, he will be scrambling to cover his a** for his over-the-top accusations against the BPD.
     
  7. Tricia

    Tricia Administrator Staff Member

    From Keenan's April 7 2003 statement;

    "I have carefully reviewed the Order of United States District Court Judge Julie Carnes in the civil case of Wolf
    v. John Ramsey and Patricia Ramsey. I agree with the Court's conclusion that "the weight of the evidence is more
    consistent with a theory that an intruder murdered JonBenet than it is with a theory that Mrs. Ramsey did so."

    "For several months, my office has been investigating new and other unpursued leads, most of which involve the
    possibility that an intruder committed this crime. We are proceeding with the full cooperation of the Ramseys,
    Detective Lou Smit, and the Boulder Police Department. We are all focused on the apprehension and successful
    prosecution of the killer of JonBenet."


    Fedorax what if Mark Beckner came out with this statement after the ruling. I doubt one single person would back up the Chief of Police in Boulder he if said something so outrageous and unprofessional.

    Keenan has the whole case file. If she has bothered to read it she wouldn't have said a word. If Keenan has read the case file and still feels the need to come out with this bizarre backing of a joke of a civil case then she is worse than I thought.

    I am giving Keenan the benefit of the doubt in thinking she must not have read the case file.

    I do believe the investigation in Keenan's office is directly influenced by Lin Wood and his threat of a lawsuit.

    Lin Wood threatened and expensive and long lawsuit if the BPD was not removed from the case. It was. Lin Wood drops his threat.

    Spade I think this is part of why Lin Wood thinks he is invincible. He got Keenan to lie down like a good lap dog. Why not put another nail in the BPD coffin and go all over national TV claiming they made up a major piece of evidence. His ego is beyond out of control. His ego is psychotic. His ego is letting him believe he will never have to face the consequences of his actions. Pretty soon Wood will think he is invisible.

    DejaNu I too believe that Keenan needs to be held accountable. What if she is still looking into the ridicules MW crap? What a waste. Of course the office needs to look at every lead but why does Keenan get to keep looking at leads that a 8 year old can see are false and yet is not held accountable for recklessly spending taxpayers money?

    Does she get carte blanche to do whatever she wants? You are right DejaNu. Keenan has had the case since Dec. 2002. What has she done? Waste time? Chase down leads that have been chased by the BPD and proven false? Chase down leads from nuts who send her frozen underwear?

    When is Keenan going to be held accountable for NOT LOOKING AT THE REAL EVIDENCE?

    Keenan has proven herself to be weak. To be Lin Wood's mouthpiece.

    Is it possible that Keenan released the 911 tape to the public because she knew she had to? Think about it. Since Wood did his little dog and pony show for Katie could Keenan have really argued that the tape couldn't be released? I don't know honestly but I bet not.

    I think Keenan released the tape, not for any noble reason, but because she knew she couldn't hang on to the tape since Lin Wood did took his psychotic ego and tape on the Today Show for the public to enjoy.
     
  8. Ginja

    Ginja Member

    Wood's Control

    Keenan has to be held accountable for her actions. She not only cow-towed to Wood's threat of suit, but she was totally unprofessional and biased in hiring Lou Smit and John Douglas!!!

    Talk about stacking the deck!!!

    And Tricia, you're on target (as usual) in pointing out what would have happened if Mark Beckner had publically supported such an outrageous claim as made by Carnes.

    One has to tread very carefully the BDA's handling of this investigation....there are stink bombs planted everywhere. :eek:
     
  9. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    Fed: "That's not how these things work. A cold case group cannot come into an investigation unless they're invited. And that's only done for cases that have been shelved. The Ramsey case is being actively worked. I think we should give
    Keenan and her team all the support they need to get the job done."

    The governor of any state has the statutory power and authority to remove a case from the hands of its LE and DA that is nonactive, i.e., NOT being actively investigated, and place it in the hands of a special prosecutor or a cold case team, Fed. That constitutes an "invitation" and in this case, it is justified. Keenan has done nothing in almost a year but back a ridiculously defective court ruling from another jurisdiction, make public statements about Ramsey innocence, seat a discussion panel, hire a retired cop and sidestep lawsuits from homicide suspects. Those activities under no definition whatsoever constitute the "re-investigation" she publicly committed to almost a year ago. To the best of my knowledge, Keenan has never publicly disclosed the budget she has been given to conduct such a "re-investigation" and has made no other public comment regarding its current activities, contacts or involvement (aside from the retired cop) of any experts or other "fresh eyes." She has merely given it back to the same old same old eyes, including Smit's, who handled the case under Hunter. Doing so defies any definition of a "fresh look" as well.

    Stun-gunning more piglets, more discussions regarding the suitcase, the scuff mark and Smit's ridiculous intruder theory that even many "internet junkies" have analyzed and debunked far better than any elusive experts under Keenan have accomplished is a waste of time and money. Has Keenan's "re-investigation" re-interviewed witnesses, retested evidence, consulted new experts??? Have they done anything that would, to most intelligent minds, lead anyone to believe there is an active investigation ongoing?

    Keenan has public accountability for her "re-investigation" efforts, as well as legal accountability to Owens. If there is something that Keenan IS doing that constitutes a reasonable and rational active investigation, perhaps you could enumerate what that might be. Don't get me wrong, Fed, I'm very, very grateful and appreciative of your devotion to keep us informed and am willing to be open-minded about Keenan's efforts on the case IF someone can just tell us what IS being done to investigate....

    The only way this case is going to move forward is if it is placed outside Colorado jurisdiction into the hands of experts who don't have political connections but a clear motivation to solve the case.

    If doing so resurrects the risk of lawsuits from the Rs, damn the torpedoes and full speed ahead! It may serve the case well...when the Rs come out publicly with suits that clearly show they are enemies of the Colorado judicial system, perhaps those within the system won't be on fire to back their innocence.

    Patience may be a virtue, but wisdom moves the hand of God....
     
  10. AK

    AK Member

    IMHO

    You are filling a vacuum with negative theories -- borne, I'll grant you, on an endemic depression many have adapted over years of seemingly no progress. But in lieu of facts, don't jump to the worst case scenario.

    Wood has shot his wad. There's nothing else he can present.

    Keenan's statement isn't worth getting ulcers over. It's a serious concern to be threatened by someone who litigates for sport. The case is bigger than her statement.

    The people involved with this case are not giving up. They believe there can be an arrest and prosecution, if not more than one.

    Work is being done.

    Science is advancing to create avenues we didn't have before.

    We're just frustrated that we're not privy to the goings on. We need to get over that.

    Just think -- we'll be all the more impressed when we see this all unfold on Court TV!



    If you want a good mystery, figure out why Darnay betrayed his clients and the case!
     
  11. Tricia

    Tricia Administrator Staff Member

    "We're just frustrated that we're not privy to the goings on. We need to get over that."

    I can't get over it. I want to know everything right now. The powers that be should spill their guts to me. I won't tell a soul. Except you. On the forum. That's it. :winkaway:

    You are right Fedorax. Frustration. That sums it up.

    Tricia
     
  12. AK

    AK Member

    I know, I know

    Can't we just drop some truth serum in their Sparkletts bottle?

    Here's something to consider. I think we can assume that people who are working the case are reading this forum to measure reaction. Our passion and noodging have to mean a lot to them. It lets them know we haven't stopped caring and might give them some inspiration to push a bit more on their own.

    You know how we get emotional over the injustice of it all? Imagine being someone who attended the autopsy, or looked through a 50X microscope at evidence, or interviewed someone they feel is guilty and gotten smug responses. Think of those folks and know they are way ahead of us in wanting results.

    They will need to be on the stand giving their all one of these days. We want to keep these folks encouraged.
     
  13. Spade

    Spade Member

    Re: IMHO

    Two great quotes from FedoraX. Now here is one from Ashleigh Brilliant: "More problems in the world are caused by stupid people than by evil doers."

    I think this quote is the answer to FedoraX's query about Darnay. At the same time, I agree with FedoraX that Darnay has betrayed his clients and the quest for justice for JonBenet. However, Darney's FU's in the Ramsey case still don't top the incompetence he exhibited in "defending" the subway guy.
     
  14. LurkerXIV

    LurkerXIV Moderator

    Agree

    Darnay Hoffman is not the sharpest knife in the legal drawer.

    In fact, most of Greenleaf's lawyer jokes seem to be written with Darnay in mind.
     
  15. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    No New Vidocq Review

    Apparently, Vidocq has only been asked to review this case once, in 1998, and has not been contacted by Keenan et al since taking it over in Dec., 2002. Let's see, no Vidocq, no Dr. Henry Lee...who IS working the case?

    Sorry, I cannot accept not knowing what's going on, if anything, in this "re-investigation." Keenan and her team have public accountability and we the people have the right to know.
    ***
    Updated at 10:00:05 AM MST Thursday, January 29, 1998

    Ramsey ransom note gets new look

    By MATT SEBASTIAN
    Camera Staff Writer

    Meeting in Philadelphia today, a secretive international crime-fighting organization will take a crack at deciphering the JonBenet Ramsey ransom note.

    But don't expect the group of forensic experts to solve the year-old slaying, the organization's spokesman said Wednesday.

    "The Vidocq Society has a history of investigating and looking into unsolved murders that are normally years old," said spokesman Dick Lavinthal. "However, the society is not involved in any way with the investigation of this particular crime."

    Robert K. Ressler, a famed former member of the FBIs violent criminal apprehension team, is scheduled to give a presentation today on the phony ransom note in the Ramsey case.

    "This is neither prosecution- nor defense-oriented," Ressler said."Essentially, Im just doing this from the outside looking in."

    Ressler said he wouldnt be dropping any bombshells, but would simply analyze the ransom note, along with some autopsy reports and other public records.

    Named after the 18th century French detective Eugene Francois Vidocq - considered the father of modern criminal investigation - the 150 members of the 8-year-old organization meet twice a month to review "long-cooled" homicide cases. Lavinthal said the group has, in the past, helped both prosecutors and defendants prove their cases.

    JonBenet Ramsey was found murdered in her parents Boulder home Dec. 26, 1996. Prior to the discovery of the body, the 6-year-olds mother found a three-page ransom note. There are no suspects in the case, although investigators have said the girls parents "remain under an umbrella of suspicion."

    Although the Vidocq members dont plan to review the full Ramsey case, Lavinthal said, any new revelations gleaned from the ransom note presentation will be forwarded to Boulder police.

    "Im sure if, for some reason, someone were to propose something that might be germane, we will make sure to communicate that to the right people," Lavinthal said.

    Boulder Police Chief Tom Koby, when told of the secretive forensic society, said he has no problem with the groups plans to study the bogus note.

    "Nothing bothers me in this case anymore," Koby said.


    Copyright 1998 The Daily Camera. All rights reserved. Any copying, redistribution, or
    retransmission of any of the contents of this service without the express written consent of The Daily Camera is expressly prohibited. Permission to the Vidocq Society granted 98-01-30 by Max Nealon, Online Content Editor.
     
  16. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    If Smit and Keenan are so damned sure of their intruder theory, why doesn't Smit present it to Vidocq for "fresh eyes" review?????
     
  17. AK

    AK Member

    Deja Nu

    Good question. Here's the answer: Because they know enough about the case to not spend even one minute entertaining anything Smit has to say.

    Spade, that quote is ON THE MONEY! Yes, Darnay's stupidity harmed the case to a degree more serious than perhaps any other single person. I doubt he set out to do that, but were I him, if I saw things going that way I would have amended the situation no matter what personal embarrassment or hot water I might have encountered. Instead he slithered away leaving many people to question his intentions in the first place and wonder whether he was bought off and for how much.

    Every single person who has questioned the motives of others in this case should turn a giant magnifying glass on Hoffman. His clients may not have the money or strong case to sue him, but it might be appropriate to advise the state board what he did and let them decide if it rose to the level of malice beyond incompetence.

    But then I publicly told NYL from day one that hanging a suit on Patsy's handwriting was ill-conceived and could backfire. I take no pride on seeing I was right.
     
  18. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    But...but Lou Smit is so lengendary.
     
  19. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    He is like so legendary.
     
  20. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    Bob: "But...but Lou Smit is so lengendary."

    Yeah, and Keenan is SO sure...

    Fed, I don't disagree with you re NYL, I also advised the Wolf suit was a long stretch...when the exemplars were deemed inadmissible, the case collapsed. Without the exemplars, expert testimony regarding them and the entire issue of PR's handwriting similarities to the RN were a foregone conclusion. I understand, however, and maybe erroneously, that NYL paid costs/fees to LW in his client's behalf, an honorable gesture.....
     
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