Traipsing With The Body

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by Nandee, Jan 23, 2002.

  1. Nandee

    Nandee FFJ Senior Member

    I hope this link works. When I saw this floorplan, I had to wonder why an intruder would pick the 'wine cellar'? There were many places to leave the body without traipsing through the entire basement....
     
  2. Tricia

    Tricia Administrator Staff Member

    well

    Looks like the "wine celler" is the farthest place from JonBenet's room. Perhaps the crawl space might be farther but not practical because then Patsy wouldn't be able to drag JonBenet into the crawl space without getting dirty.

    Thanks Nandee. I hadn't seen the layout like that before. Makes it easier to understand when it's presented like this.

    With this layout in front of us I want to pose a question.

    How many of you think John Ramsey moved the body to the wine celler from another room in the basement when he went disappeard around 11:00 am that morning.

    How many think he discovered the body right where it was but before he went down with Fleet White. Again around 11:00 am.

    How many think he discovered the body for the first time when he went down with Fleet White.

    Voyager I remember you posing an interesting theory about this once didn't you?

    Nandee I hope you don't mind but with your layout in front of us it will help us visualize what might have happened.

    Thanks
    Tricia
     
  3. Nandee

    Nandee FFJ Senior Member

    Tricia

    No... I don't mind at all! This layout is a great visual of what the killer did and it really doesn't add up.... At either point of entry to the basement, from the window or the stairs, there were closer places to hid the body.....
     
  4. Zan

    Zan FFJ Senior Member

    stairs?

    Did the killer come down the stairs marked A&B or the ones marked H....? I know we really don't know...but which stairs have the police been assuming the killer used...I'm confused now...looking at this diagram...clearly it would have been easier to go down the H stairs....Was there anyway to access the H stairs from JB's room...or was there just access to those stairs from the parents room....??
     
  5. JR

    JR FFJ Senior Member

    Blueprint of house

    <html>
    <body text="#000099" bgcolor="#CCFFFF" link="#00CC00" vlink="#FF0000" alink="#993366">
    For blueprints of the house try the site links below.&nbsp; As I recall, the BPD felt it made more sense for the killer (if an intruder) to take the back stairs since they were closer to JonBen&eacute;t's bedroom and further away from the Ramsey's room (less likely to be heard or seen by the parents or Burke.)
    <p>http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Senate/6502/primer2/primer10_blue.html
    <p>http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/local/article/0,1299,DRMN_15_408302,00.html
    </body>
    </html>
     
  6. Zan

    Zan FFJ Senior Member

    OH...OK...

    I see were I got confused...A&B on the diagram is the window grate....LOL...I thought it was another set of stairs...
     
  7. Camper

    Camper Banned

    Crawl Spaces

    The two crawl spaces have drawn my interest before. The cover a vast area under the Ramsey house! We had a crawl space under our large home, and the access was about 4 feet from the floor, and the interior of the crawl space was just plain dirt.

    In my opinion a savvy intruder, who knew the family and the house, would have chosen to hide the body in there. With all the time he had in the house that day, per the Pro Ramseys, he could have dug a grave in there that the police would not have seen, or apparently Ramsey nor the police actually looked in those crawl spaces, I am guessing!

    To have hidden the body in there, would have allowed our savvy intruder to have most likely collected the $118,000.00 dollars, before equipment to search a vase area of dirt! There again I am assuming ---- that the crawl spaces were just dirt and not finished in any way.

    Nandee if our savvy intruder came early that day, he probably looked in the entire basement for a spot to put the body, the wine room was a very poor choice, IMOP.
     
  8. Vic

    Vic Active Member

    I think

    He discovered the body when he dissapeared for a while. After that time his demeanor and behavior changed, the pensive, drinking John.

    What was he thinking? Did Patsy REALLY do it? Was it a bungled kidnapping? I think he was trying to put together pieces and make a decision of what to do. Arndt gave him an opportunity when she said to search the house, he could "find" the body and move on to another phase.

    I believe the cold hard business side of JR took over and it became a situation to solve, his love and loyalty for JonBenet nonexistant.

    Another thing, think how hard it would be to carry a 45 lb. dead weight child. I think the "stun gun" marks were places where Patsy bumped JB into something in the basement. Carrying her in a horizontal manner could result in her lower back and face hitting something waist level. She had to be put down to open the wine cellar door, that is where urine was found in front of the door.
     
  9. Zan

    Zan FFJ Senior Member

    Right Vic

    John was thrown through a loop and jumping through hoops that day...He read the note again....

    ". Don't try to grow a brain John. You are not the only fat cat around so don't think that killing will be difficult. Don't underestimate us, John. Use that good, Southern common sense of yours. It's up to you now John! "

    He decided not to underestimate....
     
  10. Nandee

    Nandee FFJ Senior Member

    Angel

    You made me go swampdiving!!

    I found this Jamsey Ramsey post interesting:

    The blue robe was found on the third floor in John's office/dressing room.

    Who mentioned a blue robe? It is not designated on the floorplan, so why did she mention it?

    I know NYL questioned Patsy about a dark robe, but that was the first time I can remember a robe being mentioned??
     
  11. Camper

    Camper Banned

    Nandee

    That 'blue' robe was kicked around over at WS, I remember reading about the blue robe, but I don't remember where I read it!

    I bet Zan remembers! Her memory and records are pretty good.
     
  12. Nandee

    Nandee FFJ Senior Member

    Camper

    We tossed it around on my 'Good Mother' thread... but the pop-tarts got in the way!!
     
  13. Zan

    Zan FFJ Senior Member

    the blue robe

    Thanks for the drink Angel! You must have told them to fix me a double....TeeHee!!! Party on!(hic-up)

    Hey....the only thing I remember in this state ...is that the blue robe was found DOWN STAIRS....and that.... If I remember correctly.... a pillow was found in the vicinity....maybe it was PMPT...if so it fits in my theory.....it would have been taken from two movies....which played on LifeTime in 1996....Right now, I think it was part of pr's movie clues ....one where the brother was accused(but innocent), and another where mommy WAS the perp....
     
  14. Nandee

    Nandee FFJ Senior Member

    the robe

    Dark-toned fabric. Police noticed navy blue pillings - or fuzzy balls from cloth - on JonBenet's lower body, sources said. Investigators later found John Ramsey's dark-colored bathrobe on the floor of his home office next to a desk, sources said. "Some of the police thought the pillings could have come from the robe," a source said.

    http://www.thedailycamera.com/extra/ramsey/1997/07/18-1.html
     
  15. Voyager

    Voyager Active Member

    Tricia, one of my scenarios was....

    That during the time when John disappeared and was unaccounted for, he might have been moving JonBenet's body from one of the cars in their garage, where he and Pasty had placed it earlier, hoping to dispose of it once the police did a search of the house, and left to chase down the intruder and call out the Russian army....

    Just happened though, that one detective stayed on the scene hours after the time frame for the ransom call, and he realized that at least some of the investigation would remain in there home.....and that JonBenet's body would be found....just a matter of where.....

    I think that was when he realized how incriminating it would seem if JonBenet's body was found in one of their cars....so he moved it to the farthest corner of the basement....

    Of course when Linda Arndt ask him to look around for anything suspicious, that was his chance to "innocently" find the body....and of course we know from Fleet White's report that he quickly went straight to wine cellar and JonBenet's body.....
     
  16. Nandee

    Nandee FFJ Senior Member

    Voyager

    Interesting.... Is there an entrance from the garage to the basement?
     
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