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  1. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by Little
    I agree that it doesn't have to be something that someone hit JonBenet with, that it very well could have been something JonBenet hit her head on. That's why her being flung around fits with what my thoughts are on the red top. She was propelled against something, not that something was propelled at her.

    If I'm wrong it sure won't be the first time

    Little
    I agree.

  2. #74

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    Quote Originally Posted by AMES
    What really ticks me off, is the fact that when she sees the photo of the red turtleneck and begins to cry (or PRETENDS to cry)....she is asked if she would like to take a break. WELLLLLL.....after the break, she is not asked another question about that turtleneck. I posted that portion of her interview on here...under "Patsy's Interview...things that were strange or out of place". I will go back and find it. Why wasn't she asked...."Patsy, before the break, I showed you a picture of the red turtleneck on the bathroom counter, and you began to cry. WHY?? What IS IT about that particular turtleneck that made you break down??" But NOOOOO....not another word about that turtleneck was uttered. I have often wondered if Patsy pretended to cry....so that she could "REGROUP"....maybe think of a lie to tell about it or something. She completely lucked up when she wasn't even questioned about it, after the break. How lucky can you get?? Geesh.
    Here we go..

    22 THOMAS HANEY: Number 18?
    23 TRIP DeMUTH: How about the red
    24 item in the upper right-hand corner?
    25 PATSY RAMSEY: I think it's a
    0266
    1 little turtleneck, a little cotton turtleneck, 2 and I had wanted her to wear it to the Whites
    3 and she didn't want to wear it.
    4 TRIP DeMUTH: How did it end up
    5 there?

    6 PATSY RAMSEY: Don't remember. A
    7 crown. Oh, God.
    8 THOMAS HANEY: It's about 10:25.
    9 Do you want to take about a ten-minute break,
    10 how's that sound? We will come back.
    11 PATSY RAMSEY: (Crying.) (INAUDIBLE
    12 RESPONSE.)13 (Recess taken.)


    14 THOMAS HANEY: We are back on tape
    15 and it's about 10:59 a.m.
    16 And before we go back to the
    17 photographs, on the break, there, we were
    18 talking about a letter that you said that -- or
    19 a card, whatever it was, that McReynolds sent.



    From AMES: No you weren't..you were talking about the red turtleneck....remember the RED TURTLENECK? The one that is balled up on the bathroom counter, and Patsy "can't remember" how it ended up there? The one that, when you showed her a picture of it, she broke down crying...and had to take a break? Remember THAT ONE?
    Thanks so much for posting this, Ames.

    When asked how the turtleneck ended up there (in his book, p. 37 hardcover ed, S. Thomas says it lay balled-up on the bathroom counter), Patsy's reply is "Don't remember".
    When in an interview or interrogation, suspects answer that they "can't remember", this often indicates deception. I think it was Mark McClish who pointed this out on his very interesting "Statment Analysis" site.
    After her "Don't remember" reply, Patsy suddenly mentions a crown which probably could be seen in the same picture, and starts to cry. I believe she wanted to direct the attention away from the turtleneck at all costs, using the crown as a red herring here.
    She wants to be pitied by the investigators as the grieving mother, and they fell for it, giving her a break. Again, Patsy got what she wanted.

    And it is indeed unbelievable that after the break, Haney did not pick up where they left, questioning her more about the red turleneck. Again, another crucial opportunity to corner Patsy was lost.

    I have read somewhere that it was Lou Smit who recommended Tom Haney as an interviewer ...
    Last edited by rashomon; December 24, 2007, 6:31 pm at Mon Dec 24 18:31:04 UTC 2007.

  3. #75
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    Thomas Haney was a stupid twit here. as Ames stated below.

    From AMES: No you weren't..you were talking about the red turtleneck....remember the RED TURTLENECK? The one that is balled up on the bathroom counter, and Patsy "can't remember" how it ended up there? The one that, when you showed her a picture of it, she broke down crying...and had to take a break? Remember THAT ONE?

    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  4. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by rashomon
    Thanks so much for posting this, Ames.

    When asked how the turtleneck ended up there (in his book, p. 37 hardcover ed, S. Thomas says it lay balled-up on the bathroom counter), Patsy's reply is "Don't remember".
    When in an interview or interrogation, suspects answer that they "can't remember", this often indicates deception. I think it was Mark McClish who pointed this out on his very interesting "Statment Analysis" site.
    After her "Don't remember" reply, Patsy suddenly mentions a crown which probably could be seen in the same picture, and starts to cry. I believe she wanted to direct the attention away from the turtleneck at all costs, using the crown as a red herring here.
    She wants to be pitied by the investigators as the grieving mother, and they fell for it, giving her a break. Again, Patsy got what she wanted.

    And it is indeed unbelievable that after the break, Haney did not pick up where they left, questioning her more about the red turleneck. Again, another crucial opportunity to corner Patsy was lost.

    I have read somewhere that it was Lou Smit who recommended Tom Haney as an interviewer ...
    I believe that you are right about that crown...JB had a gazillion crowns...and in some of the photos, Patsy was shown JB's trophies and other crowns..and she didn't break down...so why do it with this particular picture? Red herring, indeed!!! (And if you think about it...why blubber over a crown anyway? She didn't break down when she was shown pictures of JB's other belongings...for example, her Easter basket, her backpack...etc)

  5. #77

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    Patsy dominated that interview. Haney was out of his league. So was Smit. There are so many questions that weren't followed up on, that needed to be asked and answered. Even when he asked the right question, Haney would barely let Patsy get a word in edgewise. He'd go on and on...AND HE'D INTERRUPT HER ANSWER! Drives me crazy to even watch the videos we have of these interviews. I keep saying SHUT UP AND LET HER ANSWER!

    Too late now.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

    ~~~~~~~
    Bloomies underwear model:
    3 Dimensional

    ~~~~~~
    My opinions, nothing more.

  6. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase
    Patsy dominated that interview. Haney was out of his league. So was Smit. There are so many questions that weren't followed up on, that needed to be asked and answered. Even when he asked the right question, Haney would barely let Patsy get a word in edgewise. He'd go on and on...AND HE'D INTERRUPT HER ANSWER! Drives me crazy to even watch the videos we have of these interviews. I keep saying SHUT UP AND LET HER ANSWER!

    Too late now.
    Makes me mad too. I can't believe that he just let the red turtleneck slide on by, without questioning her further about it....especially after she broke down after seeing the picture. There was more to that, than meets the eye. Why did they have to pick such a dimwit to interview her?? Geesh...I could have done a better job.

    In this portion of the interview...after the break, and talking to her about a Christmas card, he finally gets back to the pictures...BUT NOT to the picture that they left off with, the one with the red turtleneck. NOOOO..he shows her another bathroom picture....but, its a picture of an unflushed potty!!!! GASP...horrors upon horrors....she MUST be guilty, she had an unflushed potty in her home!!! An unflushed potty spells guilt to me....lets just gloss over the picture of the red turtleneck that she broke down over, and had to take a break to collect herself over.

    12 TRIP DeMUTH: And you, before we

    13 took a break, you got a little upset. How you

    14 doing, okay now?
    15 PATSY RAMSEY: I'm okay.

    16 TRIP DeMUTH: Did you have any

    17 medication during our break or anything like

    18 that because you said you brought the Ativan?

    19 PATSY RAMSEY: Yes, but I didn't

    20 take it.

    21 TRIP DeMUTH: If you wouldn't mind

    22 letting us know if you do.

    23 PATSY RAMSEY: Okay.

    24 THOMAS HANEY: I think we left off,

    25 finished with number 18, and it's a bathroom, so

    0273

    1 go to 19.
    2 PATSY RAMSEY: This one looks like

    3 somebody went to the potty and didn't flush.



    FROM AMES:: So after the crying break, when Patsy was shown the red turtleneck....they came back to the interview, and the first thing that Haney starts talking about is a Christmas card, from McReyolds. And then, when they finally get back around to the pictures....he says..."I think we left off, finished with 18, and its a bathroom, so go to 19". And of course...19 is a picture of an unflushed potty. (Yuck!)....WHY OH WHY didn't Haney go back to the picture of the red turtle neck??? That is the picture that they left off with...before having to take a break because Patsy started stalling....uh, I mean..."crying". He missed a golden opportunity there...IMO. He let Patsy's fake tears get to him.

  7. #79
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    Again and again, we see the "poor Patsy, she's just a distraught rich mommy" viewpoint from anyone in Boulder LE (except Steve Thomas of course). They never treated the Ramseys as suspects, did they? It was as though the interviews were mere formalities, meant to satisfy the public or internal pressure, but never meant to actually gain information about JonBenet's death. Haney never pressed Patsy, Lou Smit never pressed John. They were sympathetic, something LE is NEVER supposed to be toward suspects. It's outrageous!
    "We're not necessarily doubting that God will do the best for us; we are wondering how painful the best will turn out to be." - C.S. Lewis

    MY OPINIONS - DO NOT COPY THEM ANYWHERE ELSE ON THE INTERNET!

  8. #80
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    Default The Ramsey's own words

    This post #78 says it all for me. They never followed through with this red top.


    The Ramsey's own words
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by koldkase
    Patsy dominated that interview. Haney was out of his league. So was Smit. There are so many questions that weren't followed up on, that needed to be asked and answered. Even when he asked the right question, Haney would barely let Patsy get a word in edgewise. He'd go on and on...AND HE'D INTERRUPT HER ANSWER! Drives me crazy to even watch the videos we have of these interviews. I keep saying SHUT UP AND LET HER ANSWER!

    Too late now.


    AMES:
    Makes me mad too. I can't believe that he just let the red turtleneck slide on by, without questioning her further about it....especially after she broke down after seeing the picture. There was more to that, than meets the eye. Why did they have to pick such a dimwit to interview her?? Geesh...I could have done a better job.

    In this portion of the interview...after the break, and talking to her about a Christmas card, he finally gets back to the pictures...BUT NOT to the picture that they left off with, the one with the red turtleneck. NOOOO..he shows her another bathroom picture....but, its a picture of an unflushed potty!!!! GASP...horrors upon horrors....she MUST be guilty, she had an unflushed potty in her home!!! An unflushed potty spells guilt to me....lets just gloss over the picture of the red turtleneck that she broke down over, and had to take a break to collect herself over.



    *snip*

    FROM AMES:: So after the crying break, when Patsy was shown the red turtleneck....they came back to the interview, and the first thing that Haney starts talking about is a Christmas card, from McReyolds. And then, when they finally get back around to the pictures....he says..."I think we left off, finished with 18, and its a bathroom, so go to 19". And of course...19 is a picture of an unflushed potty. (Yuck!)....WHY OH WHY didn't Haney go back to the picture of the red turtle neck??? That is the picture that they left off with...before having to take a break because Patsy started stalling....uh, I mean..."crying". He missed a golden opportunity there...IMO. He let Patsy's fake tears get to him.
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  9. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elle_1
    This post #78 says it all for me. They never followed through with this red top.


    The Ramsey's own words
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by koldkase
    Patsy dominated that interview. Haney was out of his league. So was Smit. There are so many questions that weren't followed up on, that needed to be asked and answered. Even when he asked the right question, Haney would barely let Patsy get a word in edgewise. He'd go on and on...AND HE'D INTERRUPT HER ANSWER! Drives me crazy to even watch the videos we have of these interviews. I keep saying SHUT UP AND LET HER ANSWER!

    Too late now.

    Nope, and what I don't understand is....there HAD to have been a reason that she broke down over that particular picture....so much so, that a break had to be taken. She didn't break down like this over any other picture...just this one. I have said before, that even after being shown pictures of JB's Easter Basket, her backpack, her trophies, and many, many other things...she did NOT break down and cry. But, then suddenly breaks down over a red turtleneck, and Haney doesn't ask her why?? WHY Haney WHYYYYY?????????

  10. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by AMES
    Nope, and what I don't understand is....there HAD to have been a reason that she broke down over that particular picture....so much so, that a break had to be taken. She didn't break down like this over any other picture...just this one. I have said before, that even after being shown pictures of JB's Easter Basket, her backpack, her trophies, and many, many other things...she did NOT break down and cry. But, then suddenly breaks down over a red turtleneck, and Haney doesn't ask her why?? WHY Haney WHYYYYY?????????
    Patsy was a crafty one. She could turn on the drama. Tom Haney got caught in the web Patsy was weaving. You write a great account of this Ames. This red top scenario has always irritated the hell out of me.

    Patsy Ramsey succeeded in causing confusion with the investigation of her daughter's death. From the ransom note to the contamination party and everything else in between.
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  11. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elle_1
    Patsy was a crafty one. She could turn on the drama. Tom Haney got caught in the web Patsy was weaving. You write a great account of this Ames. This red top scenario has always irritated the hell out of me.

    Patsy Ramsey succeeded in causing confusion with the investigation of her daughter's death. From the ransom note to the contamination party and everything else in between.
    Yes, she was quite the actress. She could have won an Oscar for all of the acting that she did after the death of her daughter. One of her greatest acting roles, was having the "breakdown" after seeing the picture of the red turtleneck. That was nothing but a stall tactic in my opinion. She was probably thinking..."Oh NOOO, there is a picture of that red turtleneck. I was REALLY hoping that they would have overlooked that. What am I going to do? What am I going to say? She WAS wearing that turtleneck when she wet the bed, afterall. I can't let them know that this was an accidental murder due to toilet rage. But, what if they know that the shirt was wet? What if they ask me about that? What will I say? How do I explain THAT one? Help me Jesus....what should I DO? Oh, I KNOW....I will turn on my fake tears, and maybe, just maybe....Haney will let me take a break, I can collect my thoughts, and think of something to say. If I get REALLY lucky, maybe he will just forget about the picture of the red turtleneck altogether. Yep, that SURE would be nice".

  12. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by AMES
    Yes, she was quite the actress. She could have won an Oscar for all of the acting that she did after the death of her daughter. One of her greatest acting roles, was having the "breakdown" after seeing the picture of the red turtleneck. That was nothing but a stall tactic in my opinion. She was probably thinking..."Oh NOOO, there is a picture of that red turtleneck. I was REALLY hoping that they would have overlooked that. What am I going to do? What am I going to say? She WAS wearing that turtleneck when she wet the bed, afterall. I can't let them know that this was an accidental murder due to toilet rage. But, what if they know that the shirt was wet? What if they ask me about that? What will I say? How do I explain THAT one? Help me Jesus....what should I DO? Oh, I KNOW....I will turn on my fake tears, and maybe, just maybe....Haney will let me take a break, I can collect my thoughts, and think of something to say. If I get REALLY lucky, maybe he will just forget about the picture of the red turtleneck altogether. Yep, that SURE would be nice".
    My post #80 above was meant for your "Unfinished thread." Sorry, Moab. I have just copied it there.

    Yes, Patsy was in control Ames. She knew what she was doing.


    I remember reading Steve Thomas stating Patsy knew how to play the men? Half leaning across the table and staring right into his eyes. Words to this effect.
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.



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