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  1. #25
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    He's being taken back to california - not Boulder. Does a charge for possessing child porn take higher priority over a charge for child murder???????

    Or does this mean they have the DNA results?

    ETA - I found the answer to my own question:-

    When back on American soil, Karr will stay in Los Angeles for one to two days while his paper work is process so he can be extradited to Boulder, Colo., to face charges of murder, kidnapping and sexual assault of a child.
    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,209437,00.html
    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  2. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayelles
    He's being taken back to california - not Boulder. Does a charge for possessing child porn take higher priority over a charge for child murder???????

    Or does this mean they have the DNA results?
    I think it's a different issue, Jayelles. I believe it's to "process" him from the flight he's going to be on, which goes to California, not Colorado. He's not on a private plane, but a commercial one.

    I'm trying to get this right: he has to be turned over legally, from ICE to the Boulder LE. Something like that. Paperwork. Etc.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
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  3. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase
    I think it's a different issue, Jayelles. I believe it's to "process" him from the flight he's going to be on, which goes to California, not Colorado. He's not on a private plane, but a commercial one.

    I'm trying to get this right: he has to be turned over legally, from ICE to the Boulder LE. Something like that. Paperwork. Etc.

    You're right KK - I edited my post.
    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  4. #28

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    Jay, he belongs in CA where they DO have an outstanding case against him.

    While he's out there allegedly waiting for extradition paperwork to be completed, that buys Lacy time to get prelim DNA results. If they're anything but a match, there will be no trip to Boulder for Karr because there IS no evidence that Karr's "confession" is substantiated in any credible evidence and therefore viable for successful prosecution.

    This sudden "diversion" of Karr's destination is nothing more than legal maneuvering by Lacy to cover her :(:(:(, first with inserting herself into Karr's disposition without any true legal authority or basis, and now, providing a handy excuse for not charging him, which is going to be the grand finale to Boulder's illegal involvement in all this. Apparently Lacy is more concerned with claims of professional incompetence than finding the killer of JonBenet. What ELSE is new in Boulder?????

    When Smit et al finally took their bogus "intruder" to Lacy, she should have had an outstanding warrants check run on Karr first. Had she done so she would have discovered the Petaluma warrant. Then she should have contacted the Petaluma DA and allowed him/her to contact the feds and Thai authorities to pick up Karr and hold him for extradition back to CA, not Boulder. Had she followed protocol, she could easily have gone over to Petaluma when Karr was back to "question" him about the Ramsey case then. That would have been competence, professional courtesy to the jurisdiction that already HAD authority over Karr and a much cheaper and easier way to handle any concerns she might have had about Karr's involvement in the Ramsey case. It would have also kept the entire affair on the down low as Lacy said she really wanted in her ridiculous press conference.

    But as usual, she ignored all of it to indulge yet another fraudulent claim by Smit et al and create a public drama that has cost American taxpayers a shitload of money and now made her look like an idiot. Again.

  5. #29

    Default Dejanu

    They are deporting Karr - I think due to the "death penalty" restrictions laid out in our extraditon treaty with Thailand, but I'm not sure.

    My question is, does this process make any difference in the time it takes to process him once he is back here?

    http://today.reuters.com/news/newsAr...E-JONBENET.xml
    "The pedigree of honey
    Does not concern the bee,
    A clover, at any time, to him,
    is aristocracy."
    Emily Dickinson.

  6. #30

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    I believe he is being deported by Thailand because of his California conviction in absentia for possessing child porn.

    Since jams and Bluefire have been brought up on threads already, and since we know that Karr was online back in 1996, trolling for kids on his website he set up to "counsel" them, I have wondered if he was hunting up child porn with jams, as well. Or maybe he was even just "researching" the JonBenet case by looking for child porn links, like jams said she did. Remember, she didn't seem to understand that she could easily have been arrested for having those images on her computer, and it would have been exactly the same charges as Karr, or comparable with whatever N.C. had on the books for laws against child porn back then. People tried to tell jams she was breaking the law, but she didn't seem to care, and she got away with it. Maybe Karr was doing the same, but got caught.

    Of course, I'm just speculating. Like Bluefire, if Karr was doing "research," he enjoyed it, IMO.

    But back to the question of deportation, there was some talk at first when the Karr story broke, about Thailand cracking down on their child sex trade for tourists. Those sickos really do go there specifically for sex with children and it's very horrible to hear about it. They've had some TV programs on that in the last year, news reporters investigating and documentaries, that kind of thing. I couldn't watch after a few minutes. One had children offering themselves to the reporter for various acts, with a woman and man in charge. Heartbreaking.

    But I don't think the death penalty is any issue for Thailand in this. Since Karr hasn't been charged with the murder, he's just been "arrested" for it, if that makes any sense.

    What I want to know is HAS THE DNA TAKEN FROM KARR ON THURSDAY been processed? It only takes a short time to do a test now. I saw a news report that said he'd AGAIN have his DNA taken in Boulder when he got back.

    So what happened to the Thai test? Dr. Baden said on TV a couple of days ago that Thailand has labs for DNA testing and they could have done that quickly.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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  7. #31

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    "I believe he is being deported by Thailand because of his California conviction in absentia for possessing child porn."

    KK, Karr has NOT been convicted in absentia in the CA case! He was set to stand trial on MISDEMEANOR possession charges but skipped out on his bond at which time the Petaluma court issued a bench warrant for his arrest (SOP). He left the country and Petaluma apparently didn't pursue satisfaction of the warrant until Karr surfaced in Thailand in connection with the Ramsey case. Also SOP. He's a low level defendant in the Petaluma case. Media reports are conflicting regarding whether Lacy had an arrest warrant issued on Karr in the Ramsey case. Thai officials are not deporting Karr either. They merely revoked his visa and held him until US officials could come and take custody of him. We are presently awaiting a ruling from the Thai court for extradition, not deportation.

    No doubt this guy was trolling for victims on the internet and that's how Gray and St. Augustin found him. We all know that in their minds, any pedophile will do. According to today's headlines, some freelance Boulder journalist ran into Karr in Paris and, upon discovering his avid interest in the Ramsey case, hooked Karr up with Tracey.

  8. #32

    Default

    There won't be a trial, don't hold your breath. If there ever is a trial, family and press would get X amount of seats and whatever is left over is for the public, Westerfield had about 10 seats available. I can't recall about OJ, but they were few too, and they were by lottery. Westerfield was first come first served, and your seat was lost during breaks unless you got to the front of the line again.

    This guy was nowhere near Boulder in 1996 and the DNA and handwriting will not match.


    Lacy is biding for time so they are going to extend his stay in Los Angeles as long as possible.

  9. #33

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Deja Nu
    "I believe he is being deported by Thailand because of his California conviction in absentia for possessing child porn."

    KK, Karr has NOT been convicted in absentia in the CA case! He was set to stand trial on MISDEMEANOR possession charges but skipped out on his bond at which time the Petaluma court issued a bench warrant for his arrest (SOP). He left the country and Petaluma apparently didn't pursue satisfaction of the warrant until Karr surfaced in Thailand in connection with the Ramsey case. Also SOP. He's a low level defendant in the Petaluma case. Media reports are conflicting regarding whether Lacy had an arrest warrant issued on Karr in the Ramsey case. Thai officials are not deporting Karr either. They merely revoked his visa and held him until US officials could come and take custody of him. We are presently awaiting a ruling from the Thai court for extradition, not deportation.

    No doubt this guy was trolling for victims on the internet and that's how Gray and St. Augustin found him. We all know that in their minds, any pedophile will do. According to today's headlines, some freelance Boulder journalist ran into Karr in Paris and, upon discovering his avid interest in the Ramsey case, hooked Karr up with Tracey.
    Well, there you have it. I've heard a number of times he was already convicted on the CA case, but then, about 9/10ths of what I've heard hasn't been right, has it? Thanks for the info.

    I have missed the journalist hookup story. Anyplace online I can read that?

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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  10. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sabrina
    There won't be a trial, don't hold your breath. If there ever is a trial, family and press would get X amount of seats and whatever is left over is for the public, Westerfield had about 10 seats available. I can't recall about OJ, but they were few too, and they were by lottery. Westerfield was first come first served, and your seat was lost during breaks unless you got to the front of the line again.

    This guy was nowhere near Boulder in 1996 and the DNA and handwriting will not match.


    Lacy is biding for time so they are going to extend his stay in Los Angeles as long as possible.
    They allow cameras in the courtroom in Colorado, I keep hearing on TV. Whether a judge would allow it is another question. I doubt it. Too much against the Ramseys to let people see when the defense cut into them. Haddon will not have it, and he controls the system in that state, apparently.

    Personally, I'm DYING for this to go to trial! What's a little DNA? We've staked the ranch on it not meaning anything! Handwriting match? WHO NEEDS IT?! Any fool could see Patsy was a dead ringer...but no arrest there.

    TAKE THE MAN TO TRIAL! PLEASE!

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

    ~~~~~~~
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    3 Dimensional

    ~~~~~~
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  11. #35

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    It will go to trial if Lacy wants yet another chance to prove how incompetent she is. Otherwise, Karr's heinie will rot in a CA psych facility/jail till he's older than dirt. If he'd just faced the music back when he was charged, he'd be a free man by now. Very bad judgment.

    Thinking back to 2000 when these very same people declared BPD and Alex Hunter's staff grossly incompetent, it's just mind boggling how much time has been wasted while the world, and more importantly, JonBenet, has been forced to wait for justice while this set of incompetents get their shot at exhonerating the Ramseys. Even more bad judgment, which is what this entire case boils down to.

  12. #36

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    Found the article with the info on how Tracey and Karr got hooked up. Very interesting. Notice that this article also explains the "picture of Karr" issue that was in one of the emails published. I wondered how Tracey would get a picture of Karr without him giving it to Tracey, if Tracey didn't even know the man's name. Now we know:

    Karr's intermediary
    Journalist put suspect in touch with CU's Tracey
    STORY TOOLS
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    By Charlie Brennan, Rocky Mountain News
    August 19, 2006
    A Boulder freelance journalist initiated the relationship between John Mark Karr and a University of Colorado professor that led to Karr being named the suspected killer of JonBenet Ramsey.
    Karr was fascinated with the JonBenet case and could rattle off Boulder landmarks, said Michael Sandrock on Friday, recalling his conversations with Karr in Paris, where they became acquainted in the summer of 2002.

    Karr, a 41-year-old schoolteacher arrested in Bangkok, Thailand, on Wednesday, will be brought to the United States on Sunday to face charges of murder, kidnapping and sexual assault of a child, a police official said today. "The tickets for John Mark Karr's departure are ready," Thailand's immigration police chief, Lt. Gen. Suwat Tumrongsiskul, said. "He is leaving for the United States on Sunday evening."

    Suwat did not say where Karr's flight from Bangkok would land or the number of U.S. officials who would accompany him.

    Sandrock, 48, was in Paris for a week of distance running when he had a chance meeting with Karr on the Left Bank. Karr became excited after learning that Sandrock was a Boulder resident. Sandrock writes regularly about running for the Daily Camera.

    As the conversation between the two men developed, Karr cited articles about the JonBenet case that appeared in the Camera and in the Rocky Mountain News, Sandrock said.

    "He asked me, 'Who do you think did it?' I didn't really have an opinion," Sandrock said. "I care more about Hemingway than I do the JonBenet Ramsey case. But I said, 'Some people think the parents did it, and some people think an intruder did it.' "

    The idea that John and Patsy Ramsey were involved in their 6-year-old daughter's death brought a "little smile" from Karr, Sandrock said.

    Sandrock recalls meeting with Karr several times that week in Paris. "Every conversation came right back to the Ramsey case," he said.

    During some of those conversations, Sandrock said he got the impression Karr "was holding something back. I thought it was because he did a lot of research (into the case)."

    Karr was also extremely interested to hear that Sandrock knew CU journalism professor Michael Tracey, whose documentary criticized the media for its treatment of the Ramseys had come out.

    Karr knew about the Tracey documentary, Sandrock said.

    "That's what really did it," Sandrock said. "From then on, the conversation steered through professor Tracey. (Karr) wanted to know what he was like. He asked a lot of questions about professor Tracey."

    Sandrock gave Karr his business card before leaving Paris and also put him in touch with Tracey. A few more e-mails passed between Sand-rock and Karr, but for the most part, it was Tracey and Karr who developed a long-running correspondence.

    Information Tracey gleaned from the e-mails Karr sent him over the span of four years caused the professor to alert investigators, who brought Karr to the attention of Boulder District Attorney Mary Lacy.

    Although Karr had conversational knowledge of Boulder, including the fact that the Ramseys lived on 15th Street when JonBenet's body was found in the basement of their home on Dec. 26, 1996, Sandrock said he didn't ask Karr if he had ever been to Boulder.

    "That would have been the natural thing," Sandrock said. "But I just backed off. Let's face it. He's fanatical about it, whether he did it or not. And it's not in my nature (to ask). Being in journalism, you get a lot of obsessed people. It wasn't a topic I had much interest in."

    Sandrock's role in the case surfaced this week, when the News obtained a number of the e-mails that had passed between Karr and Tracey.

    In one e-mail exchange, Tracey wrote to Karr: "I did have one thought, spurred by your reference to Mike Sandrock. If I asked Mike for a copy of the photo he took of you and sent it to the Ramseys or other members of the family, would they recognize you?"

    Karr's response indicated he was upset that Tracey might have a photograph of him.

    "What?" Karr wrote. "I am in total shock that, in all this time that I have been talking to you, Sandrock has a photo of me. I once asked you if Sandrock would recognize me if he saw a photo of me, and you merely said yes. You NEVER said he HAD a photo of me. This changes everything. You have everything but my name and fingerprints. This comes as a major blow. Why did you not tell me this in the past?"

    Sandrock said he never had such a photograph.

    "No, I never gave him (Tracey) a photograph," he said. "I don't have one. I never had one. I thought I might have, and I didn't have it."


    Sandrock likened the back- and-forth between Karr and Tracey to a "chess game" between two men who chose their words very carefully.

    Sandrock described Karr as "clean-cut" and "athletic" in appearance, "just like (any other) American traveling in Europe." He also considered Karr very smart.

    "That was my impression of him," Sandrock said, "that when he was corresponding with professor Tracey, he had an agenda, and I get the feeling like this (Karr's confession and arrest) is still part of the chess game. He sacrificed a piece - himself - and whether there is something more behind it, I don't know."

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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    3 Dimensional

    ~~~~~~
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