In English Please

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by Barbara, Aug 22, 2006.

  1. Barbara

    Barbara FFJ Senior Member

    He is being charged....but not formally charged

    He is not under arrest......but in custody

    California dropped the charges.....but he is still in jail there

    He is remanded?

    He confessed.......but not a confession according to the talking heads due to his "wording". (I was with her when he died)

    admission vs. confession?

    What happens after 72 hours in Colorado? If (and when) they finish with him and find him NOT the guy, is he just a free man to do and go wherever he wants?

    Of all weeks for this to be going on. My week at work couldn't have been worse and I just don't have the energy to follow the technical stuff so I'm hoping that someone can answer these questions in layman's terms in plain English and dumb themselves down long enough to tell me what the hell is going on?

    BTW, to make it worse, I am obsessing with the possibility of what MIGHT have happened to his twin little GIRLS during a "home delivery" while he managed to have three healthy little BOYS. I e mailed a number of newscasters rather than LE just because they might be more motivated to bring it up for ratings and be FIRST with this angle. I sent this inquiry to Catherine Crier (although I have been disappointed on her Ramsey coverage over the years), Abrams, and a few others. Let's see what happens. I'm watching Crier now.

    I was hoping because they have been known to read e mails on the air, without having to be responsible for bringing these issues up themselves and subjecting themselves to legal problems. It's always possible with the right people watching that someone else might pick up on it and follow the idea. I think it is worth looking into.

    This guy is a nut (but make no mistake, he is very intelligent) and has problems with little girls, especially dead girls, and coincidentally, his twin GIRLS did not survive. After hearing about his mother and childhood, I don't think it is too far out there.

    ..doesn't mean that I haven't gone over the edge, :) but I'll rest easier if I know more about those deaths.
     
  2. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    Seems like the biggest clusterphuck ever. Fox News and others have said he is definately charged with the murder of JBR, but Lacy herself says we shouldn't jump to any conclusions.

    Every time one of these hoaxes pops up, it makes the Ramseys appear ever so slightly less guilty to the average slob on the street--which is the whole point I'm sure.

    Hi Babs
     
  3. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    Barbara, I'm so sorry you are so distressed over all this. Take a deep breath, move AWAY from the computer and tv, and go for a lovely walk in the fresh air. Here are some explanations that I hope help.

    "He is being charged....but not formally charged"

    As posted on other threads, Karr cannot be officially charged with CO crimes until he is in CO. It's a legal thing. What the extradition judge read to him in this morning's hearing are the charges CO INTENDS to file against him once he's in CO.

    "He is not under arrest......but in custody"

    Karr is under arrest on two outstanding arrest warrants, one from CA and one from CO. The term "custody" ordinarily refers to someone being under the physical control of a law enforcement officer in satisfaction of an arrest warrant. How the media is using the terms to accommodate up-to-the-moment developments or backtracking I cannot explain.

    "California dropped the charges.....but he is still in jail there"

    Karr was under arrest in response to two warrants, he is in the physical custody of CA law enforcement and being held in an LA jail pending extradition back to CO. CA withdrew its warrant, not dropped any charges, so that CO could take precedence in any court hearing regarding extradition. The Sonoma County charges against Karr are still intact and will be prosecuted if he returns to CA after the CO case is resolved in any fashion. If Karr is successfully prosecuted in CO and does life or worse, that does not mean the CA charges go away. They remain but, because they are misdemeanors, may never be prosecuted.

    "He is remanded?"

    This is a legal term meaning turned over or transferred. When Karr waived his right to challenge extradition this morning, he rendered himself willing to be remanded, or turned over/transferred, to CO authority and jurisdiction.

    "He confessed.......but not a confession according to the talking heads due to his "wording". (I was with her when he died)"

    Confessions come in all shapes and forms. The videos of Karr claiming that he is not "innocent," and that he was present at JB's death can be liberally construed as a confession. Using the term "statement" now is IMO backtracking by the media.

    "admission vs. confession?"

    Again, these are legal terms, probably misused for self-serving purposes by media. "Admission" usually implies that a suspect is admitting to some case fact or statement put to him by interrogators. Admissions do not have to be confessions. "Confession" usually requires an admission that the suspect actually committed the crimes. At no time I have ever seen or heard Karr admit he strangled or bludgeoned JB, only that they "made love" which of course is a crime itself, and that he chloroformed her to do so, which is also a crime.

    "What happens after 72 hours in Colorado? If (and when) they finish with him and find him NOT the guy, is he just a free man to do and go wherever he wants?"

    If the CO case doesn't proceed to prosecution, Karr will be extradited back to Sonoma County to stand trial or plea out in that case. He will not be a free man, only divested of any culpability in the CO case, but not forever. If Lacy decides not to charge him, and he returns to CA, he can always be charged again in the CO case if new or sufficient evidence comes to light down the road. Double jeopardy rules do not apply to being arrested or charged, only to standing trial.
     
  4. Watching You

    Watching You Superior Bee Admin

    If Lacy does not charge him, Deja Nu, can he be charged with obstruction of justice for making a false confession?
     
  5. Barbara

    Barbara FFJ Senior Member

    Thank you so much Deja Nu

    Yes, that was much clearer. I understand now.

    Why can't they just say that? You said it. Why can't they?

    Don't they know there are much more of their audience like me rather than you?

    Yeah, I have to take a breath. I feel a deep need to hunt down Wood and Tracey just to slap them both and walk away. That would make me feel a lot better

    Just like this

    :rs:
     
  6. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    Yes WY, but WHY? See my post on the other thread for explanation.

    You're welcome, Barbara. The reason why media can't communicate in clear, simple, reasonable terms is because they want to sensationalize their stories to increase ratings which equals BIG bucks in their employers' pockets. That's their jobs, that's why they were hired, and dammit, employers LIKE them (Stewart Smalley)! Have a wonderful walk! :hiya:
     
  7. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    But...but have you forgotten THE MYSTERIOUS BEAR?!!!!!!
     
  8. Watching You

    Watching You Superior Bee Admin

    Just seems as if the taxpayers ought to get something for what it cost them to feed this guy's obsession.
     
  9. RiverRat

    RiverRat FFJ Sr. Member Extraordinaire (Pictured at Lef

    Barbara

    Passion is always productive and you have more than helped out around here lately! I only worry about the ones without a fire burning within right now....so that leaves you out. Thank you!
     
  10. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    BobC, of course, there was only ONE mysterious bear ever manufactured in the entire history of the world and Karr had it and gave it to JB.

    WY, I think we should deduct the cost of this fiasco on our tax returns. Afterall, if the system can use our money any way they want, we should be able to as well. :crosseyed
     
  11. Barbara

    Barbara FFJ Senior Member

    Hi Bob :hug: :hiya:

    Despite the frustration and clusterphuck, this is the best thing that could have ever happened for JonBenet

    Renewed WORLDWIDE (not even just local flurries of activities like we've had for ten years that no newscasts cared about) ATTENTION. This is now a bigger story than Iraq and the Middle East (I personally admit I am glad for the break of the real "man's inhumanity to man"); for a little while for something that, while tragic, considering the world situation, is a respite. For all of US who have been involved and interested for all these years, this clusterphuck was something that we and the world will want its pound of flesh for.

    I can't wait to see the "punishments" and "consequences", especially financially; not to mention the humiliation of those who couldn't be more deserving.

    I'm willing to get crazy when I hear the RST spin cause at the end of the day, I truly believe JBR gets a little justice

    And you can't get better entertainment anywhere!
     
  12. Barbara

    Barbara FFJ Senior Member

    Thanks RR

    We'll keep those fires burning
     
  13. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    I think it's a disaster. 80% of America right now is thinking the parents didn't do it and that the real killer is in custudy. I get e-mails every day from old friends telling me exactly that.
     
  14. Watching You

    Watching You Superior Bee Admin

    Bob, yesterday I overheard two of my neighbors talking about this guy. They were hoping he fries for what he did to that poor little girl. Completely bought the media baloney.

    Boy, howdy, and don't think I didn't set those two women straight real fast. And, furthermore, I said, blah blah blah, and blah blah blah. And don't believe blah blah blah. The one neighbor knows I've been studying this case for the past 10 years, and she told the other neighbor to believe me, because I know what I'm talking about.

    It's not that these people are stupid - they just haven't folowed the case and they are ignorant of the true facts. All they've seen over the past few years on TV has been RST BS. If that's all I had seen on TV and didn't know any different, I'd probably believe it, too. It's sad.
     
  15. Barbara

    Barbara FFJ Senior Member

    Let's look at the glass as half full Bob :toast: If we don't we'll go mad

    Before this probably 90% of Americans thought the parents didn't do it

    After this is over, I'm thinking that 90% of Americans will know the parents have involvement and the WHOLE WORLD will be thinking Ramsey, bringing more attention, and who knows, maybe some new theories and analysis.

    I got a lot of calls also in the beginning, and now I'm getting them to say, okay, I defer to you from now on. Of course, these are people UNlike us, who don't follow the case
     
  16. Moab

    Moab Admin Staff Member

    And that is what Lacy and Wood are hoping for...just like the Carnes decision and her inane statement afterwards...they are hoping to get the public to tip the scales in favor of the Ramseys before Lacy either sweeps it under the carpet or retires - whichever comes first.

    Also, the media...they are sooooooooooooo into being FIRST, whether they are RIGHT or not...it has nothing to do with journalism anymore, and hasn't for years.
     
  17. Barbara

    Barbara FFJ Senior Member


    EXACTLY!

    THAT'S why this will be good. As long as there are high ratings, the media will :pray: eventually get the truth out.

    The Carnes fiasco was dry and not sensational so it got little attention, save for the Lin Wood and RST spin heads, with LE unable and unwilling to comment on this "investigation"

    Now, there is nothing they can do. Ratings = $$$$ and as long as the ratings are there, and Karr (being sensational himself) is giving them the ratings (good choice Tracey). The talking heads aren't so afraid to speak up now that Wood, :wood: Lacy :glug: and Tracey :dracula: et al have given them the ammunition to legally comment with their asses covered, given the blatant blunders committed. They handed them their right to trash them by their own doing, just like the Ramseys

    I'm gonna think good thoughts about all this

    I am I am I am I am :coffeeup:
     
  18. VP

    VP Member

    Charges

    Charges outlined to Karr aren't formal ones
    LOS ANGELES During today's brief extradition hearing in Los Angeles, a judge told John Karr that he's charged in Colorado with first-degree murder, felony murder, first-degree and second-degree kidnapping, and sexual assault on a child, in the JonBenet Ramsey case.

    Karr slowly closed his eyes when the first of the murder counts was read.

    But those might not be the actual charges he faces. A spokeswoman for prosecutors in Boulder County says the charges were listed in a probable-cause arrest warrant, and aren't formal.

    Karr will now await transfer to Boulder, where the murder of the six-year-old girl took place a decade ago.

    Copyright 2006 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.
     
  19. Deja Nu

    Deja Nu Banned

    True, VP, I've posted a similar CBS article on other threads. The BDA spokeswoman spoke to reporters at this morning's extradition hearing and explained that Karr is not charged yet (duh, he can't be till he gets to CO) and all the capital charges upon which the probable cause arrest warrant were granted are charges they MIGHT file against him when he gets there. That tells me that at as of at least 11:00 am PST Tuesday, 8/22/06, Lacy still did not have sufficient evidence to fry Karr for anything. And, according to the two San Francisco attorneys who are "advising" but not representing Karr, he will definitely be represented by counsel in CO and will not be pleading guilty to anything. Furthermore, Karr had a public defender represent him in this morning's extradition hearing which tells me he's not waiving his right to representation, a good thing. And those attorneys also have said that to the best of their knowledge NO DNA SAMPLE WAS TAKEN ON KARR WHILE IN THAILAND!

    I believe Karr's on track now and is prepared to cooperate with whatever attorneys he'll have in CO to fight Lacy tooth and nail. I wonder if they'll fight about taking a DNA sample once he's ensconced in the Boulder County Jail....
     
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice