Hard To Keep Focused

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by Gaiabetsy, Mar 19, 2002.

  1. Gaiabetsy

    Gaiabetsy Member

    It's kinda obvious to me I'm having trouble keeping focused on this case especially since old Patsy got sick again. I feel like I'm beating up on someone not able to defend herself with the same flair and dedication as before. Now, I'm not saying just because someone (a guilty person) gets sick doesn't mean they're absolved of guilt or don't need to be punished for what was done, but it's hard to continue on this mission for JonBenet.

    This is assuming I think (and I do) Patsy had something or a lot to do with the death of her daughter. It just makes my job more unpleasant - know what I mean?

    I try to remember Richard Speck. In his later years in jail, he was shown to be a real horrible piece of work. Then, he got sick and died a very unpleasant death. Yet, there are some people who still maintain he is innocent. OK, maybe he isn't a good example. After all, he was just plain AWFUL as a human being.

    Does anyone suffer burnout about this case because of similar feelings? How do you overcome them?

    Also, don't you wonder why someone like Patsy wouldn't TELL ALL sometime before death? Sure ... she's not dead yet, and maybe she'll be healed by another power again. Guess she might be keeping her options open.

    That last question leads me to weight the idea BURKE DID IT with new eyes!!

    I'd appreciate any feedback.
     
  2. JR

    JR FFJ Senior Member

    Gaiabetsy

    Burke was cleared by the BPD. IMHO, there is no reason to backpeddle.
     
  3. Moab

    Moab Admin Staff Member

    Gaiabetsy

    It is hard sometimes to keep up the energy level when you feel cheated by the justice system, I hear you on that one…but BDI??? No way! Not then…not now!

    As far as Patsy confessing goes…that is another big NO WAY…but if she does not win her battle with cancer…John will be singing like a canary blaming her so HE can go on with his life.

    So, I don't know what to tell you GB…except…all good things come to those who wait!
     
  4. Watching You

    Watching You Superior Bee Admin

    Nah

    Burke didn't do it, but I feel sorry for Burke having to grow up in that nutty family with all that baggage holding over his head. He will forever be known as the brother of that little girl who was found murdered in her own basement, and most people think his own parents did it.
     
  5. Texan

    Texan FFJ Senior Member

    cancer return

    I know what you mean. It is kind of tough to keep hoping for prosecution of someone whose cancer has returned. I asked a general surgeon I work with what the prognosis would be for someone who had stage four cancer, a remission for six years, then a positive liver biopsy and he just shook his head back and forth.

    I think this would be the reason one or both parents would cover for the other, perhaps knowing that the cancer could return someday. I think if BDI they would have admitted it. Maybe if Patsy doesn't beat cancer this time she will find enough guts to confess, whether she did it or JR did it, just so he could have a life later.
     
  6. AK

    AK Member

    Good topic

    Gaiabetsy, it's like any other long-term struggle. You put one foot in front of the other and keep going. Keep your laser focused on the big goal, but make allowances for the things that change the balance. Patsy's cancer is a concern and may well bring something new to the table.

    But you're not allowed to give up. ;) Or look at Burke. ;)

    The longer cases go on, the more the gremlins will try to distract you with garbage. Don't get fooled.

    I don't know anyone who ever thought Richard Speck was innocent. He became a rather pathetic old queen after spending a long time in jail, taking female hormones, but I'm not aware of any remorse he ever expressed for his victims. I think the world is better off without him.

    While I'm here let me say YIPPEE!!! Camm was found guilty! If you want info on this case, go to the WLKY-TV site in Louisville.
     
  7. Dunvegan

    Dunvegan Guest

    FedoraX: Good the jury brought in the conviction...

    ...against that former Indiana State Trooper who murdered his wife and two young children for over a half-million in insurance monies.

    <img src="http://a1844.g.akamai.net/f/1844/95/10m/images.ibsys.com/2001/0412/649645_200X150.jpg">

    Here's a link to a history of the case at WLKY-TV, The Louisville Channel:

    http://www.thelouisvillechannel.com/lou/news/stories/news-131264120020319-190356.html
     
  8. Tricia

    Tricia Administrator Staff Member

    Thanks Fedorax and Dunvegan for the heads up on this.

    Fedorax did the defense offer any other theory as to who may have killed his family? I am skimming though it now but there is a lot of material

    Very interesting reading. Thanks again.

    Tricia
     
  9. Tricia

    Tricia Administrator Staff Member

    I can't control it.

    Once again I am a serial thread killer.

    I will turn myself in to the forum authorities..

    {{{{sigh}}}}}}
     
  10. Dunvegan

    Dunvegan Guest

    My understanding is that Camm had three main motives:

    1. For the money: He wanted desparately to invest in a somewhat murky land deal one of his male relatives was involved in...but he didn't even have a fraction of the amount he would have come up with.

    Therefore: Over a half-million in insurance collectable upon the death of his wife AND (a separate policy) the two children would have given him a way to invest big time.

    2. To cover molestation of his post-toddler daughter. The autopsy showed her to have been raped within several hours of when she was found dead in the garage of the family home with her mother and brother.

    3. To free him to chase women. Lots of women testified that he had either had intercourse with them or tried to intimidate them into sex.

    Not a nice party, Mr. Camm.
     
  11. AK

    AK Member

    Nice job, Dunv

    You covered the bases perfectly. The trial was notable for a few reasons. The timeline got messed up when the alarm company had to confess they had forgotten to adjust for daylight savings time, so a call made at a specific time was actually an hour later. There were some jurors who got seriously hung up on that, but luckily they saw the light.

    I'm eager to know more about the molestation charges. That came up very gingerly and when it seemed like it would be a battle of experts and not especially germane to the prosecution when they had the other issues (insurance money, debt, womanizing) it got dropped. I know someone whose testimony was critical to another aspect to the case so hopefully I can find out though it may be months before I'm able to do so.

    I believe there were eleven of Camm's basketball buddies who took the stand and said he was with them at a critical time, but they all seemed to come on strong, then fold, and the jury didn't buy their story. Reminds me of the Mark Chmura case a while back when he was charged with raping an underage girl, and his family and friends gathered the troops and intimidated this girl even inside the courtroom. Chmura was acquitted. Makes you wonder how people can support friends or even family members when there's compelling evidence of a person's guilt.

    While I'm here -- BobC, the Knoller/Noel jurors were very impressed by Nedra Ruiz's passion and presentation. While you and I think she was a terrible actor with awful stunts, her strategy may have worked, not in getting Knoller off, but to impress future clients. I doubt she'll get much money for this case, and it cost her (I think) $500 in a fine, but a future paying client will think she'll go to the mat for him or her, so she probably did herself a favor. I still say she reminds me of Gilbert Gottfried, and that's no compliment!
     
  12. Vic

    Vic Active Member

    "Mad Dog" Nedra

    I don't know, but I think I'd have to be a real nut to want her for my lawyer. But I guess that's what they usually are so I guess she'll be real popular... Arf


    Don't you just feel sick sometimes, thinking about all the poor little kids and innocent people that end up victims to these *******s? I'm kind of with the "kill 'em and be done with 'em" school...

    Tricia, I know just how you feel...bang bang - we're dead!
     
  13. zapata

    zapata Senior Member

    Patsy may have cancer

    and I would not wish that horrible disease on my worst enemy, but JonBenet is still dead. Patsy has had over 5-years that JonBenet did not have.

    Patsy has traveled to Spain, the Caymans, Florida, Chicago and many other places JonBenet did not get to go.

    JonBenet's grave has been made a show place, and has been put on display in death as in life.

    Patsy will never confess, nor will John if Patsy goes before him. They will take their secret to their grave and to hell with them. Their pride will not let them confess. They have gone too far to turn back.

    When I think of Steve this verse comes to mind:

    "AS WATER REFLECTS A FACE, SO A MAN'S HEART REFLECTS THE MAN".........PROVERBS 27:19

    I believe that this verse describe's Steve's heart. When I read in Schiller's book about Steve and his partner going back to the house the Ramsey's lived in while in Atlanta, the very house they lived in when JonBenet was born. When Steve saw her little hand prints in the cement that was poured while the Ramsey's lived there, he broke down in tears.

    There is no doubt in my mind that his feelings about the injustice in this case are real. I will never believe he wanted this settlement. I believe he had no choice due to the others involved in the suit wanting to settle.

    It took a lot of courage to stand up and be counted when the whole justice system in Boulder was against you. I feel I know Steve's heart and I feel sure that the reason he has not contacted us is that he is in mourning.

    The Ramsey's were on NBC for a couple of minutes night before last. They were announcing the settlement. From what I have read, the settlement is not even completed yet, but the Ramsey's and Wood have to get their spin out first. That is how they play the game.

    I hope and pray that we will all start writing letters about the injustices in this case, and keep demanding that a new grand jury will be setted, that the Ramsey's will be called to testify before this grand jury, and that this case will be moved to Denver and be prosecuted by a Denver DA that has enough guts to go up against the Ramsey's criminal attorneys. I wonder if the Ramseys ever paid their criminal attorneys and Armistead in full? I doublt it, and they may not be so anxious to defend them if a grand jury gets another shot at this case.

    Why not call the Ramseys to testify before a grand jury, who cares if they get to look at their previous testimony and the testimony of others. They already have that information via Lou Smit and Hunter.

    zap
     
  14. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    Fedora--did you say Nedra would "Go to the mat" for a client--as in on all fours?
     
  15. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    Here she is going to the mat:
     
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