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Thread: PatsyRamsey.com

  1. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase
    I once head-butted hubby in the chest in a game of KICK BALL, for heaven's sake. HAVE NO IDEA WHY THAT HAPPENED. Had NO conscious thought whatsoever that I AM GOING TO HEAD BUTT HUBBY.
    And never once in my life have I ever had the thought that I wanted to head butt someone.
    My guess is that your Hubby made a remark about having sex with your sister: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13936455/

    Don't despair KK, your violent outburst may have you puzzled, but it also qualifies you to play professional soccer in France!

  2. #74
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    Talking

    Hey, we're trying to have a serious conversation here. If we need comic relief Greenleaf will break in and tell us to go sit in the corner for a while.

  3. #75

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    Quote Originally Posted by BluesStrat
    My guess is that your Hubby made a remark about having sex with your sister: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13936455/

    Don't despair KK, your violent outburst may have you puzzled, but it also qualifies you to play professional soccer in France!
    Oh good. I was thinking about looking for a job....

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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    3 Dimensional

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    My opinions, nothing more.

  4. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase
    hahaha I can think of a few times my "dark side" has jumped out to surprise me. I once head-butted hubby in the chest in a game of KICK BALL, for heaven's sake. HAVE NO IDEA WHY THAT HAPPENED. Had NO conscious thought whatsoever that I AM GOING TO HEAD BUTT HUBBY. He just kicked the stupid kid's ball and next thing I know, I have a neck injury and the Fam is rolling on the ground laughing.

    Hey, I wasn't even MAD at him!

    And never once in my life have I ever had the thought that I wanted to head butt someone.
    I guess your experience might be similar to French soccer star Zinedine Zidane in his very last soccer game in this year's World Cup. An Italian player said something to him and BAM! Zidane walks up and slams him in the head. What a way to end his stellar soccer career...And his team lost the game on top of it.

    Edit: I see the link above was all about that incident. Having watched it in real time, I still cannot believe it happened. What an idiot.
    Heymom
    "We're not necessarily doubting that God will do the best for us; we are wondering how painful the best will turn out to be." - C.S. Lewis

    MY OPINIONS - DO NOT COPY THEM ANYWHERE ELSE ON THE INTERNET!

  5. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by Why_Nut
    Thus, why it is that John Ramsey said he was concerned about what Burke might start going through when Burke turns 40. It could well be that the last thing John Ramsey wants is for Burke to "come to" and start looking inward, to begin to evaluate, from a mature adult perspective, the life and circumstances he was living through in the Ramsey household.
    That always seemed to be a very strange comment to me for John to make about his son.
    It does seem to hint that the ideas Paradox mentioned are on the right track because the comment makes sense in that context.
    So, if you were 6 yrs old, would you eat pineapple with a stranger in the middle of the night? What about the pineapple that was found in Jonbenet's small intestine?

  6. #78

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    KoldKase:

    And then there's John. He, too, can lie and smile at you the whole time. We've seen him do it often. His first wife saw him do it for years. His mistress saw him do it as well. He told us about his first attraction to Patsy in an Atlanta apartment, when she was LYING to his mistress for him while he hid behind a door and watched. THAT turned John on.
    Where can I read this juicy tidbit? I seem to have missed it. John and Patsy hooked up in late 1970s Atlanta, which I have survived to tell you was a hopping singles scene. I cannot imagine Patsy surviving long in that scene before she had to bag a husband. She was pretty and vivacious but I don't think she would have liked serial dating.

    I have always wondered, btw, if I ever ran into Johnny at Harrison's or any of the other singles joints. I actually waitressed/tended bar at a couple of places - but I fortunately do not remember a bearded business dude with a gold card. If I had met Patsy, I probably would have just shuddered and turned away.


    Paradox:

    I think Patsy's condition was made more difficult by the fact that her split-off personality factors (shadow) had gained a degree of autonomy as in MPD/DID.

    It is hard enough for all of us to try to fit our lives into the narrow confines of our social personas and to live a life "in the light" without falling to our weak side, our dark side. It is another thing when that side pursues us.

    Patsy really packed it on, trying to live in the light, didn't she? And she succeeded to a high degree. I think she created quite a shadow along the way, with the help of HER mother. Not only was she pursued by it, but I think she was actually interested in it as well. This interest took the form of crime movies and books.

    I think she tried to alert people to her condition. I think she resented John for not seeing her. I think the ransom note was an attempt at explaining what was going on.
    Continuing my education here, what is MPD/DID? - multiple personality disorder? I have read that this isn't as likely as it was once thought to be, and that some shrinks (can I call them shrinks?) don't believe it exists. So you believe that Patsy was a "Three Faces of Eve"/"Sybil" personality. I suppose she tells us that when she says "We are a group of individuals that represent a small foreign faction."

    Our dark side pursuing us - is this religious or psychological? What motivates it to pursue? Anger left over from childhood? And if she was interested in her dark side, is that because it was more thrilling and forbidden, like the cliches say?

    How would Patsy have tried to alert people? I've read her Christmas letters, but all I got out of them was that she was busy and tired, and bragged way too much about success. Hodges (I guess he's from an opposing school from you) sees references to inadequacy about sexuality in them - where she talks about John's boat "Miss America" (Patsy wasn't Miss America) for instance. But from this light/dark/multiple point of view, when Patsy writes about being a busy mom rushing about, she is actually telling us that she is managing a throng of personalities inside her?

    Would Patsy have said - John, we've got a problem here? I don't think she did.

    OK, anger at John for not seeing her - did she consciously know she was f-ed up or was this in her subconscious? I see in the ransom note where she hands it all over to him - It's up to you now John - and then the Victory! We've always wondered - Victory over what? - so Paradox, you are telling us that the Victory! was in finally releasing the dark side and showing it to John, and writing that ransom note, which psycho-Patsy thought eloquently expressed her truths.

    Yowza. Too much.

  7. #79
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    Ya, that's a lot.

    The Victory in psychological terms is the ego developing enough strength and autonomy that it can participate with the four functions of consciousness; thinking, feeling, sensation, intuition, and gain disctinction from the dissociating effects of the unconscious. The four functions are aspects of two major functions; rational/decision making (thinking-feeling) and irrational/response (sensation/intuition). This is what morality is all about: mediating response and decision making. This is graphed as an equilateral cross with the two lines ( horizontal = rational function, vertical = irrational function) and the four ends representing the four functions. Thus the Victory is saving by the cross.

    The unconscious is the dark side. It is full of complexes and archtypes. Those things have autonomy, they can move on their own and influence us. In order to manage the influence of the unconscious we need to develop consciousness. We need to become moral. This is what the Islamic jihad really is; translated as moral struggle.

    The ransom note is childish because it was written by a regressed split-off persona in the image of Sandy Stranger and the Brodie set, a group of adolescents. The "Mr. Ramsey" that the note was written to was more than the man himself. It was a parental figure, maybe even God. Patsy confused her identity with JonBenet. In her regressed state she could have confused John with "father" and like children do, she needed attention from the parent.

  8. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradox
    Ya, that's a lot.

    The Victory in psychological terms is the ego developing enough strength and autonomy that it can participate with the four functions of consciousness; thinking, feeling, sensation, intuition, and gain disctinction from the dissociating effects of the unconscious. The four functions are aspects of two major functions; rational/decision making (thinking-feeling) and irrational/response (sensation/intuition). This is what morality is all about: mediating response and decision making. This is graphed as an equilateral cross with the two lines ( horizontal = rational function, vertical = irrational function) and the four ends representing the four functions. Thus the Victory is saving by the cross.

    The unconscious is the dark side. It is full of complexes and archtypes. Those things have autonomy, they can move on their own and influence us. In order to manage the influence of the unconscious we need to develop consciousness. We need to become moral. This is what the Islamic jihad really is; translated as moral struggle.

    The ransom note is childish because it was written by a regressed split-off persona in the image of Sandy Stranger and the Brodie set, a group of adolescents. The "Mr. Ramsey" that the note was written to was more than the man himself. It was a parental figure, maybe even God. Patsy confused her identity with JonBenet. In her regressed state she could have confused John with "father" and like children do, she needed attention from the parent.

    Everyone, listen up to Paradox because this stuff is true.

    Oh, and how about this tidbit from DOI? Watch as Patsy begins to refer to herself in the third person, never a good sign of a healthy integrated personality (also note that when listing her self-definitions, her very first priority is to see herself as a daughter, not a mother):

    Quote Originally Posted by Patsy Ramsey
    One afternoon, I knew I was coming to the end of my rope. I had always thought that I was able to handle everything: my career, my checkbook, my daily schedule, my children, and my roles as daughter, mother, wife, volunteer, and friend. Now I knew that wasn’t true. Patsy Ramsey had no more places to turn. Everything was completely out of my control. At that moment, I remembered an idea, an admonition, I’d heard many, many times through the years. When I was a child in Sunday school, the teachers had talked about “complete surrender.” The idea sounded wonderful and powerful, but I had never quite grasped how people reached the place in their lives where they truly turned everything over to God.

    Now, as I listened to the lawyers and saw John wrestle with decisions, I suddenly realized that there wasn’t one thing Patsy Ramsey could do to change any dimension of this problem. I didn’t have the ability to change the hardened minds of police officers. I couldn’t control what the media was saying about me. All I could do was be silent and hope the system worked. Yet even that had produced accusations of my being hard or aloof. The entire matter was out of my hands.

  9. #81
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    There are many examples of Patys' detached coldness. How could she say "coming to the end of my rope" when her daughter's life could have ended at the end of a "rope"? It's like putting up pineapple wall paper when her daughter's last meal was pineapple.

  10. #82

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    Thank you again for sharing your thoughts and experience, Paradox. I will think about this some before I reply.

    This brings up Patsy's wedding in my mind, which I used to think was just ugly (and mean to make her sisters to wear PLAID at a wedding), but now I think we can understand it depicted the Prime of Miss Jean Brodie:
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  11. #83
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    Scottish plaid?

    Wasn't Paugh a Mason?

    Ramsay is Scottish, is Ramsey?

    Muriel Spark was Scottish.

  12. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by heymom
    I guess your experience might be similar to French soccer star Zinedine Zidane in his very last soccer game in this year's World Cup. An Italian player said something to him and BAM! Zidane walks up and slams him in the head. What a way to end his stellar soccer career...And his team lost the game on top of it.

    Edit: I see the link above was all about that incident. Having watched it in real time, I still cannot believe it happened. What an idiot.
    Heymom
    I watched it happen too! Of all the special soccer players, it had to be him. Unbelievable! Did you ever hear what was actually said to him by the Italian player? I have been busy with family and got sidetracked shortly after this World Cup game. I will need to check it on the net.

    All three of my sons were soccer players for their high school and universities. We attended all their games. It's a fantastic game, but I digress. Zinedine couldn't contain himself when he head butted the Italian player. He will never be remembered for his fame. This was his last farewell. What a shame.
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.



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