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  1. #13
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    Oh my.

    There was a lengthy documentary on tv last week which dispelled much of the misinformation about the case and some of the hate mail they have been sent is truly sick. Some are being investigated by the police.

    The latest update is that the McCanns have been quietly working working day and night for a change in the law and to help missing children charities as much as they can. They blame themselves entirely and say they will have to live with it for the rest of their lives. However, they are keen to put their energies into helping others as well as continuing to look for Madeleine.

    They are suing newspapers and websites and many websites have been closed down as a result. They seem to be winning all of their lawsuits - a sure sign of the sheer level of misinformation which has been perpetuated. The money they receive from the lawsuits goes to the Madeleine fund.

    I would do anything I could to help fine Madeleine. Even at this late stage, I'd go and join a physical search if there was any chance it would be useful. I have donated and will continue to donate to the fund.
    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  2. #14
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    From what I read this documentary wasn't produced by BBC, which indicates the interest in the case has decreased, for they were broadcasting 24/7 when Maddie went missing. The hate mail shouldn't come as a surprise, that's a price for the media frenzy they brought to themselves. There are nutsos on the loose more than we think. Maybe people didn't like the fact that the couple used the fund to pay their mortgage, I sure wouldn't if I had donated.

    An abduction can happen at any place, at any time, to anyone, even with the parents at home. It's the worst nightmare parents can face. But in this case, they simply were not there for the children and it wasn't for an emergency situation. I can't get over this. So, of course they have to blame themselves first and spend the rest of their lives looking for her. They owe this to her.

    I didn't know they were suing websites, but this "lawsuit" world is a whole world open for interpretation. Sometimes justice depends much more on the lawyers than we wish it did. I don't know how the fund is being used right now. The contract with Metodo 3 agency ended and I hope they hire some other more serious PI to find her.

    At least something good came up from this sad story: people are more aware of the danger of letting their children alone, that's for sure.
    "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Martin Luther King Jr.

  3. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nana View Post
    Rash and Elle

    The parents are still "under the umbrella" (!). The PJ surely have something on them, maybe not strong enough to win a court case. It must be hard to face the British power that came upon them, but they are still holding the "arguido" status of the celebrity parents. We don't know what happened to that little girl, and probably we never will, but I held them accountable. They were reckless in letting their children unattended many nights in a row in a foreigner country just to enjoy themselves. I don't give them a pass for this. If somebody manage to snatch the child from her bedroom without leaving evidence, it's their lack of responsibility that allowed this to happen. It's a no win situation.

    I think their story is a bad told tale.

    - The only timeline available is provided by them. If they were taking turns to watch the children every half an hour (without watches or cell phones), this would leave a very narrow window for some stranger to take the girl without a sound. I don't think a 4 years old baby would be awaken and follow a stranger without any sign of a struggle.
    If they were not watching them at all, this scenario is more plausible, but then they were more irresponsible than before and lied from the day one.

    - The only sketch of a suspect (if that can be a sketch!) is provided by one of the Tapas9 friends, as well as the accusations about Mr. Murat. How come an entire resort not having a single sight of them? Should we take their words as gospel? After many glasses of wine? Not a chance.

    For me, they should spend their time going back to Praia da Luz to help the reconstitution of the crime instead of touring the British media complaining about the investigation. They said they only would help if they have their "arguidos" status lifted. What are they afraid of? I think this is a "deja vu" all over again.

    From April, 28 news: (bold mine)

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/news...m-book%27.html

    "Kate and Gerry McCann could make £1 million from a book they are planning to write about their life since their daughter Madeleine vanished a year ago, a publisher said yesterday."

    snip...

    "It emerged recently that Gonçalo Amaral, the disgraced Portuguese police officer, plans to publish his own book. Mr Mitchell said it was an attempt by Mr Amaral, who was sacked from the investigation after criticising the British police, to make money from the case."

    How Ramsey this can be? I have a link to a YouTube video which is very worthy to watch, but I don't know if I can post it here, so if someone want to see, feel free to pm me.

    I don't think Maddie will be found, but I wish from the bottom of my heart they prove me wrong.
    Nana, I think it is allowed to give links to YouTube videos here on FFJ. I'd be very interested in seeing it.

    How could Maddie vanish without a trace in a resort full of people? This is such a mysterious case.

    What about the DNA tests the British (?) lab conducted? Have the results been made public?

  4. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nana View Post
    From what I read this documentary wasn't produced by BBC, which indicates the interest in the case has decreased, for they were broadcasting 24/7 when Maddie went missing. The hate mail shouldn't come as a surprise, that's a price for the media frenzy they brought to themselves. There are nutsos on the loose more than we think. Maybe people didn't like the fact that the couple used the fund to pay their mortgage, I sure wouldn't if I had donated.

    An abduction can happen at any place, at any time, to anyone, even with the parents at home. It's the worst nightmare parents can face. But in this case, they simply were not there for the children and it wasn't for an emergency situation. I can't get over this. So, of course they have to blame themselves first and spend the rest of their lives looking for her. They owe this to her.

    I didn't know they were suing websites, but this "lawsuit" world is a whole world open for interpretation. Sometimes justice depends much more on the lawyers than we wish it did. I don't know how the fund is being used right now. The contract with Metodo 3 agency ended and I hope they hire some other more serious PI to find her.

    At least something good came up from this sad story: people are more aware of the danger of letting their children alone, that's for sure.
    The BBC produce very few documentaries so that in itself means nothing. The channels for documentaries are Channels 4 and ITV.

    As I understand it, ONE mortgage payment was made from the fund (the last one prior to their return home). The couple had run out of money and the fund covered such expenses. I know some people felt badly about this, but I certainly didn't donate with conditions. I saw it as a search and hardship fund from the start. Some people have cruelly suggested that the McCanns coldly profited from the fund. That simply isn't the case. For all we know, they may have repaid that mortgage payment since Gerry is now back working.

    It is ironic that the parents of Shannon matthews received so much more sympathy than the McCanns and in the early days were even compared favourably with the McCanns (e.g. "this is how innocent parents SHOULD behave") Now we know theirs was an act.
    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  5. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nana View Post
    Rash and Elle

    The parents are still "under the umbrella" (!). The PJ surely have something on them, maybe not strong enough to win a court case. It must be hard to face the British power that came upon them, but they are still holding the "arguido" status of the celebrity parents. We don't know what happened to that little girl, and probably we never will, but I held them accountable. They were reckless in letting their children unattended many nights in a row in a foreigner country just to enjoy themselves. I don't give them a pass for this. If somebody manage to snatch the child from her bedroom without leaving evidence, it's their lack of responsibility that allowed this to happen. It's a no win situation.

    I think their story is a bad told tale.

    - The only timeline available is provided by them. If they were taking turns to watch the children every half an hour (without watches or cell phones), this would leave a very narrow window for some stranger to take the girl without a sound. I don't think a 4 years old baby would be awaken and follow a stranger without any sign of a struggle.
    If they were not watching them at all, this scenario is more plausible, but then they were more irresponsible than before and lied from the day one.

    - The only sketch of a suspect (if that can be a sketch!) is provided by one of the Tapas9 friends, as well as the accusations about Mr. Murat. How come an entire resort not having a single sight of them? Should we take their words as gospel? After many glasses of wine? Not a chance.

    For me, they should spend their time going back to Praia da Luz to help the reconstitution of the crime instead of touring the British media complaining about the investigation. They said they only would help if they have their "arguidos" status lifted. What are they afraid of? I think this is a "deja vu" all over again.

    From April, 28 news: (bold mine)

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/madeleinemccann/1904587/McCanns-%27could-make-andpound1-million-from-book%27.html

    "Kate and Gerry McCann could make £1 million from a book they are planning to write about their life since their daughter Madeleine vanished a year ago, a publisher said yesterday."

    snip...

    "It emerged recently that Gonçalo Amaral, the disgraced Portuguese police officer, plans to publish his own book. Mr Mitchell said it was an attempt by Mr Amaral, who was sacked from the investigation after criticising the British police, to make money from the case."

    How Ramsey this can be? I have a link to a YouTube video which is very worthy to watch, but I don't know if I can post it here, so if someone want to see, feel free to pm me.

    I don't think Maddie will be found, but I wish from the bottom of my heart they prove me wrong.
    Thank you for your latest interesting posts on young Madeleine McCann, Nana. I agree with all you are saying in your posts.

    Nana wrote:
    For me, they should spend their time going back to Praia da Luz to help the reconstitution of the crime instead of touring the British media complaining about the investigation. They said they only would help if they have their "arguidos" status lifted. What are they afraid of? I think this is a "deja vu" all over again.
    I think it would be much better if the McCanns would meet the Portuguese Police halfway, Nana. Just what are they afraid of? For leaving their children unattended that fateful night, the McCanns know they will have to suffer for the rest of their lives.

    Like yourself, I hope with all my heart this little girl will still be found alive, but the possibility of the kidnappers killing her also crosses my mind. There's no way they will hold on to Maddie because of the widespread display of her photographs.


    You can post the video url with your post.
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  6. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by rashomon View Post
    Nana, I think it is allowed to give links to YouTube videos here on FFJ. I'd be very interested in seeing it.

    How could Maddie vanish without a trace in a resort full of people? This is such a mysterious case.

    What about the DNA tests the British (?) lab conducted? Have the results been made public?
    I feel there had to be an insider in The Ocean Club, rashomon, who knew every move these Brits made, to have succeeded in a kidnapping. It went like clockwork.
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  7. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nana View Post
    From what I read this documentary wasn't produced by BBC, which indicates the interest in the case has decreased, for they were broadcasting 24/7 when Maddie went missing.
    I meant to reiterate something I have pointed out before. The BBC only reports news. The fact that they haven't been covering the case is only an indication that there is no news. The BBC has a lot of integrity in this respect. It doesn't mean they have lost interest.
    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  8. #20
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    Here is the link to the video I mentioned. There are thousands of them, but this one made me think, it has a different approach.

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRvgK6M2_7Q

    The PJ is holding the case files, they won't turn them into public record because this is an ongoing investigation. I'm not an expert in this issue, but there's something called "secrecy" in the Portuguese law. The leaks (wherever they came from) are very little compared to the cases we see outside Portugal, so I think it works, in a way.

    Jay, I watch the BBC here and I like it. The other ones you mentioned I don't remember to have watched neither when I lived in London many moons ago. Are they all connected or independent?
    To me it seems that BBC restrained its broadcast of this case a lot. I thought they were making a big event to mark the one year milestone but I didn't see any of the celebrities who was on board at the beginning to speak up. This has a meaning, open for everyone's interpretation.

    It was published that they made two months of their mortgage using the fund, but you must know better than I do about this. There are many people who didn't like it at all. It's not a matter of condition to donate, it's implicit that the fund would be used in the search for the little girl. This doesn't include to support the parents needs. At some point I saw an on line petition to freeze the fund in lights of this happenings. I'm not cruelly suggesting anything, far away from it, and I hope they can find peace some day. I'm just expressing my opinions about what is public record.

    I can't provide a link from the top of my head right now, but I read that a few days ago there was a poll about the case and only 30% of the British people believe the parents are innocent. That's a huge change for them.

    I can't comment on the Shannon case for I know nothing about it but I always have a problem with this kind of comment about how innocent people should behave. We saw this in the Ramsey and Peterson cases, and I think each person is unique. There's no book of behavior rules for this kind of situation, but there's always common sense. It's not looking at one tree that one can see the forest.

    You can be right, Elle. But they should have been warier for being in a strange country. There's no excuse for letting the children alone and not only for that night. Repeated pattern easy to follow. Don't you think it's strange they point the finger at the PJ and don't accuse Mark Werner for their apparent lack of security? I do.
    "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." Martin Luther King Jr.

  9. #21

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    Personally, I believe the McCanns are innocent, and they are paying dearly for the mistake of leaving their children alone. Even Kate's mother has come out saying they shouldn't have left them, and I think everyone knows that. The McCanns have to live with that awful knowledge the rest of their lives. There can be no greater punishment. Their suffering will never end.

    I agree with Elle who suggested that someone working at the resort could have been monitoring the schedules of the parents in leaving the children alone. That's why the kidnapper could time the abduction successfully. Several nights in a row, the parents followed the same pattern, and all the kidnapper needed was 10 minutes (maximum) to take Maddie.

    It could have happened like this:

    The door to the McCann apartment is unlocked. The kidnapper enters looking for Maddie (who he already knows is in the room). He finds Maddie and puts something over her mouth to muffle her cries. He carries her out the door to a waiting car driven by an accomplice, and they're down the road before anyone sees anything. By the time the real search is started, the kidnappers and Maddie are probably in Spain, or on a boat bound for God knows where.

    I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think the McCanns will ever see Maddie again in this lifetime. They were wrong to leave their children alone, but who among us has not made mistakes we regret. Those mistakes may have not led to the disappearance of our chidren, but he who is without sin, cast the first stone.

    Yes, the McCanns should not have left Maddie and the twins, but I don't see how the continued villification of the McCanns achieves anything. They didn't kill Maddie, and they can't bring her back. They can only wait hopelessly and try to prevent the same tragedy from happening to others. I pray to God none of us will ever know the heartbreak the McCanns have experienced, or the depth of guilt that must wrack their souls.
    Last edited by Cherokee; May 7, 2008, 9:25 pm at Wed May 7 21:25:56 UTC 2008.

  10. #22
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    You can be right, Elle. But they should have been warier for being in a strange country. There's no excuse for letting the children alone and not only for that night. Repeated pattern easy to follow. Don't you think it's strange they point the finger at the PJ and don't accuse Mark Werner for their apparent lack of security? I do.
    I understand what you're saying here, Nana. Yes, we should all be more cautious with our children when in a foreign country; especially when the children are not in their own home bedrooms, and in a strange environment. More caution has to be taken. No doubt about that.

    I think the kidnapping of Madeleine McCann has to be a wakeup call for the Tourist Industry to emphasize the importance of not leaving children unguarded. I sincerely hope they are doing something about this, so we will never have another repetition of what happened to little Maddie at the Ocean Club. It's all very sad.

    Mark Warner should have had a Security Guard patrolling the Ocean Club. I'm sure he can afford it. Yes, he deserves to take some of the blame, Nana.
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  11. #23

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    I told myself I wasn't going to get back into this case again. Just goes to show you that I hardly ever listen.

    Anyway, IMO we are comparing apples to oranges when it come to what has been acceptable between two cultures and apples to apples in the case of the discrepancy of social status.

    It seems that in some countries outside our own (the US) there is not the fear of predators that we have here. If there were, then I can't imagine that the McCanns would have left their children alone. It only takes a minute, or a few seconds for that matter, for a child disappear. Here, being minutes away from them would not be acceptable behavior.

    Still, would this be treated the same way if the parents were not of the social status that the McCanns are? Let's say it's a lower income couple who went out for wings and a few beers with their friends. They were across the street at a local bar, they went back every half hour to check on their children, and one of them went missing. Would there be a million dollar fund set up for them? Would celebrities come rushing to their aid? It's not that I think the rush to help them is in any way a bad thing. IMO that was a tremendous outpouring of compassion and that's never a bad thing. However, the couple who would have gone out for a beer are truly no different than the ones who go out for a nice meal and wine. People who work at the local factory need to relax just as much as people who work as doctors. People leave their sleeping child in a car to run into a store for "just a minute". People who have very small children need to be hyper vigilant about their safety no matter what their social status. Terrible things happen no matter what a person's social status is. That's just a sad fact of life.

    Most anyone who has ever been responsible for another person's safety can refelct back on mistakes. Fortunately, most of those mistakes do not have the tragic results of this case. There's no way to know all the dangers we may have dodged. All we can do is the best we can to minimize the opportunities.

    Little
    No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man. -Heraclitus Fragments c. 500 BC

  12. #24
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    Having a British Prime Minister as a close friend comes in handy, I guess. The same courtesy is not given to every missing child, as we all know.

    Child trafficking is all over the place these days, Little, and for tourists travelling abroad with small children, they should keep this in mind, if not, they are very foolish people.
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.



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