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  1. #49
    BobC is offline Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript and Book Reviewer
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    Default Right Cherokee

    Jonebenet was MANUALLY STRANGLED and put up a horrific fight--and they have to use space age technology to scrape DNA fragments off leggings? Why is there no DNA evidence collected off the body where it would most certainly be. This is absolute bullchit.

    Why_nut says it exactly right.


    If Lacy is that frikkin stupid--well wait--she is.

  2. #50
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cherokee View Post
    One more question - why is there none of this male DNA on anything else the intruder supposedly touched? Were they wearing gloves? If so, why weren't they wearing the gloves when they allegedly left less than microscopic bits of DNA on the panties and longjohns.

    I honestly don't know how Mary Lacy passed the bar exam. She is so bereft of intelligence, logic and critical thinking skills, and so obsessed with clearing the Ramseys, it's pathetic. Anyone with a brain in their head, including Dr. Michael Baden, can see the holes in Lacy's clearing of the Ramseys. The unfortunate truth is the media doesn't ask questions, it only repeats the garbage it hears.

    I hope every DNA expert out there goes on TV and makes hash out of Lacy's premature and idiotic conclusions.
    If it is true, then it is certainly the most compelling evidence of an intruder so far. Pity it has come from Mary Lacy who made such a c*ck up of the Karr sideshow and who has not presented a professional detachment from the case.

    I have to compare the Ramsey and McCann cases here. When Madeleine went missing, the McCanns received support and assistance from Gordon Brown and others, but when they were made arguidos, Brown and the others ceased to have any direct contact with the McCanns which I think is the professional thing to do (despite any personal opinions or feelings they may have). Mary Lacy has very much presented a pro-Ramsey stance from day one - even going to Patsy's funeral at her own expense. I do think this was unprofessional given her position.

    However, it's a development and one which would suggest an ability to take the case forward still. Forensics are advancing all the time. We've already seen cold cases being solved because a relative of a perp has their DNA entered into the database. Can they determine physical characteristics from DNA? Maybe the day wll come when we can obtain a photofit from a DNA profile.

    Surely they have more markers now? I shall await developments with interest.

    (I do take the point about touch DNA being on the garotte/pen if the perp wasn't wearing gloves.)
    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  3. #51
    RiverRat's Avatar
    RiverRat is offline FFJ Sr. Member Extraordinaire (Pictured at Left is Patsy Ramsey)
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    Default Beckner's Statement

    “The discovery of additional matching DNA in the JonBenet Ramsey murder case is important information that raises more questions in the search for JonBenet's killer. The Boulder Police Department concurs with the Boulder District Attorney's Office that this is a significant finding. The police department has continued to look diligently for the source of the foreign DNA, and to date, we have compared DNA samples taken from more than 200 people. Finding the source of the DNA is key to helping us determine who killed JonBenet. We remain committed to bringing JonBenet's killer to justice. That is, and always will be, our goal.

    "The investigation of this case has been under the direction of the DA's office for a number of years now and it would be inappropriate for us to discuss the details of this case publicly. We will, of course, continue to assist the DA's office in any way that we can, and we are hopeful that this new development will lead to the identification and successful prosecution of this child's killer.

    "We will be issuing no further statements at this time.”

    http://www.dailycamera.com/news/2008...eath/#comments
    "Don't play dumb with me, RR! You're no good at it." The Punisher

    "Although no one is anticipating a prompt resolution to this long and much-detoured case, perhaps - just perhaps - might we see one of those moments “when a chance arrow of history scores a perfect bullseye on a deserving target”? Steve Thomas 2009

    "Justice hasn't had a chance so far. Anyone who doesn't have this as their prime goal, we'll have a falling out with." Fleet White - Time Magazine

    "What happens is that evil comes in," Fleet says. "If you don't have truth, all you have are lies, then what comes in is evil. And evil just does its thing. In the Ramsey case, it just did its thing, and it's eaten up so many people."

  4. #52
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Why_Nut View Post
    Well, this is an interesting development.

    http://www.9news.com/news/article.as...5421&catid=339

    Lacy has officially cleared the Ramseys of involvement in JonBenet's murder, based apparently solely on a new finding of DNA consistent with that in the underwear, said DNA having been found on the waistband of the long johns she was wearing over the underwear.

    Discuss.


    There appears to be two threads here talking about the same subject. Why_Nut, I hope there is no objection to my posting this here (?).
    Quote:

    From the Boulder's DA Office Source: http://blogs.denverpost.com/coldcase...brutal-murder/

    As part of its investigation of the JonBenet Ramsey homicide, the Boulder Police identified genetic material with apparent evidentiary value. Over time, the police continued to investigate DNA, including taking advantage of advances in the science and methodology. One of the results of their efforts was that they identified genetic material and a DNA profile from drops of JonBenet’s blood located in the crotch of the underwear she was wearing at the time her body was discovered. That genetic profile belongs to a male and does not belong to anyone in the Ramsey family.

    They may have identified genetic material and a DNA profile from drops of JonBenet’s blood located in the crotch of the underwear she was wearing at the time her body was discovered, and they may also claim it didn't belong to anyone in the Ramsey family, and they may claim there is a man in the moon, but hypothetically that unidentified DNA could have been placed there by Patsy and John Ramsey, to further hoodwink the Boulder Law enforcement. This was the name of the game that Christmas night. Hoodwink the Boulder LE and the public.

    They were up the whole night planning and scheming, and I for one wouldn't have put it past them to have obtained the DNA from the first handy street derelict they could find during the night, and these Street people are always available. Everything else was planned from the War and Peace ransom note, to the wiping of the flaslhight on the kitchen counter; why not the unknown DNA. Patsy Ramsey was a pro at creating
    a speech overnight which won the talent competition in a Beauty Pageant, and she was capable of pulling the wool over the Law Enforcement's eyes.

    They pulled off the Crime of the Century by tying everyone in knots, not only with the fake garrote, but with almost everything else related to this case. Don't you think they both deserve a plaque erected to the two most fabulous crime schemers in the world? I think this DNA collection from a derelict would have come very easily to the master of the plan, Patsy Ramsey.


    Quote:
    http://listverse.com/miscellaneous/t...perfect-crime/


    Every year in virtually every country, crimes go unsolved - and sometimes undetected. When someone commits a crime of this type it is called a perfect crime. This is a list of ten tips to perpetrating the perfect crime. I am sure it doesn’t need to be said, this is not meant as a reference for criminals, but rather as an entertaining look at crime and detection.
    1. DNA

    DNA is the surest way to prove you committed a crime. It is absolute imperative that you do not leave ANY DNA behind you and that is very difficult. The best solution to this is to commit your crime in a place that is likely to have a lot of DNA from strangers. For example, a park, a mall, anywhere that a lot of people tend to gather. Finding your DNA will be like finding a needle in a haystack
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  5. #53
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    Default

    Guys, here is a rough draft of my press release. I used some of the great points you all brought up.

    For Immediate Release July 9th 2008
    From: Forums for Justice.org
    Contact: Tricia Griffith tgrif@xmission.com



    HERE WE GO AGAIN. BOULDER D.A. MARY LACY MAKES A FOOL OF HERSELF IN THE RAMSEY CASE.
    You would think Lacy would have learned something from her John Mark Karr fiasco

    Today, true justice for 6 year old murder victim JonBenet Ramsey has been thwarted by the very person elected by the people to protect her.

    Boulder District Attorney Mary Lacy has given the Ramseys a parting gift as she leaves office; she has cleared them of having any connection to the murder of JonBenet.

    Lacy "cleared" the Ramseys based on new DNA evidence called "Touch DNA."
    Touch DNA is exactly that. A test so sensitive that it can pick up a few microscopic skin cells left behind by someone touching an object.

    Lacy claims there is unknown DNA on the long-johns and underwear JonBenet was wearing when she died, therefore (and only Mary Lacy could make this leap) the Ramseys are innocent.

    Forums for Justice.org would like to remind Mary Lacy of what she said two years ago,

    ""The [Ramsey case] DNA could be an artifact. It isn’t necessarily the killer’s." - Boulder DA Mary Lacy, 8/28/06

    "You know, no one is really cleared of a homicide until there's a conviction, in court beyond a reasonable doubt. And I don't think you will get any prosecutor...unless they were present with the person at the time of the crime...to clear someone." - Boulder DA Mary Lacy, 8/28/06

    Mary Lacy just did what she said she could not do...clear someone.

    If this Touch DNA belongs to the "real killer" why isn't it all over the following items: ligature, paintbrush handle, tape, the white blanket, JonBenet's shirt, the flashlight, the spoon, and the bow of pineapple the "real killer" fed JonBenet before he wrote the ransom note and killed her.

    MARY LACEY PLEASE SHOW US THE SAME DNA YOU FOUND ON THE LONG-JOHNS AND UNDERWEAR ON THE OTHER ITEMS USED IN THE MURDER. DID THE "REAL KILLER" TAKE OF HER GLOVES WHEN SHE LEFT A COUPLE OF SKIN CELLS ON THE PANTS THEN PUT THEM BACK ON AS TO NOT LEAVE ANY MORE DNA?

    Patsy Ramsey stated she put the long-johns on JonBenet. Her DNA must be on the long-johns too. So why isn't she mentioned?

    Lacy claims the DNA on the long-johns match DNA on the underwear. It would be nice if Lacy could make the very logical conclusion that there was transference of a few skin cells since the long-johns WERE PULLED OVER THE UNDERWEAR.

    The DNA is not even a full complete sample. Has that changed?

    Forums for Justice.org would like to ask Mary Lacy one final question; WHAT ABOUT THE 2 1/2 PAGE RANSOM NOTE. The note has been matched to Patsy Ramsey's handwriting by several well respected handwriting analysts.

    Remember Mary Lacy was sure she had the killer in 2006. John Mark Karr was another red herring offered by Mary Lacy. As citizens interested in justice we must question everything Mary Lacy tells us. She can't be trusted as she has proven time and time again.

    There are hundreds of other examples of common sense observations in the JonBenet Ramsey case that escape those in the Boulder DA's office.

    Mary Lacy's world of Ramsey common sense does not exist.

    Tricia Griffith
    Forums for Justice.org
    tgrif@xmission.com

    PS. It will be interesting to see where Mary Lacy ends up in the private sector.
    Last edited by Tricia; July 9, 2008, 8:55 pm at Wed Jul 9 20:55:29 UTC 2008.
    tgrif@xmission.com
    FFJ C/O Tricia Griffith
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    Suite H #214
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    I am unaware of anyone who's profited from exploiting the Ramsey murder over a longer period of time, with a greater disregard for the principles of accuracy and fairness, than the production team of Mills and Tracey.They truly do inhabit a different moral universe from real journalists. It's the difference between journalism and propaganda.
    Alan Prendergast,reporter for Westword

  6. #54
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    Cool A friend called me at home

    to ask if I had heard the news. What news I asked. Why...the Ramseys have been cleared by DNA. My first thought was WTF??? But then I signed on to read what you all have said. And I see that may of you have said it all. Like some of you, I want to know of that chain of custody and where the articles of clothing have been kept all these years. What other articles have been tested for this touch DNA? Once that is done the list should be interesting as to whose TOUCH DNA is all over those items that were used in staging this crime. So many good points from all of you.

    Tricia, good press release!
    "When are we going to get our heads out of the sand and understand that sometimes really nice people who look good on the outside are dastardly on the inside." Wendy Murphy, former prosecutor, MA

  7. #55
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    Default Hi Elle

    Your scenario is certainly possible but I think that I have a more likely one if indeed foreign DNA not belonging to family members was found in the crotch of Jon Benet's panties...

    I think the most likely explanation is DNA contamination of the panties at the time of manufacture which then co-mingled with Jon Benet's blood at the time she bled out into her underwear after being molested with the paintbrush. Or even from DNA on the paint brush that co-mingled with her blood cells when when she was being assaulted...

    Now I am no expert, but if we can think of at least two or three possible scenarios for the presence of the foreign DNA why can't Mary Lacy? HHmmm guess sometimes money or the promise of a new position sometimes dull the o'le brain cells eh?

    As for the "touch DNA" (new term?) found on the waist band of the leggins...Firstly have the authorities proven that they are a match for the foreign panty DNA?
    If not then of course, the same sort of manufacturing contamination is a virtual likelihood!

    Where are the professionals in this case? I am among those who think this newest information from Boulder is outrageous and should be confronted by a Special Prosecutor. If this new DNA business is all they have, there is still no proof to clear the Ramseys and certainly a lot of clear and lasting evidence that points to the Ramsey guilt....The Boulder authorities and/or a Special Prosecuto need to take another look at the ransom note...then they can hardly make a public statement clearing the Ramsey!

    Voyager

  8. #56
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    Default I agree Zoomama...

    Excellent, concise press release Tricia! Is there a space on your document where V. can type in a "YES!"?

    Voyager

  9. #57
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    Default

    My S-I-L's father (who worked in the FBI Labs in DC) told me years ago that the most "compelling evidence" in the JBR case is the "ransom note." IMHO, this is still true even with the finding of this "new scientific evidence."
    “Politicians are like diapers. They both need changing regularly and for the same reason.” -- Anonymous

  10. #58
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    Default Shadow

    When I read the article on CNN...my first thought was jeez...that perp must write identical to Patsy! What a farce Lacy is trying to sell the public!!! Didn't Ramsey team say this was not a DNA case??? Of course ole Johnny boy is sucking it up. Finally cleared in the public eye...OR so he thinks!!!

  11. #59
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    Default

    Wendy Murphy is kicking azz on Nancy Grace. She said, OK Lacey, if you are clearing the Rams, there is nothing to gain by keeping all the evidence pointing towards them to yourself. Wendy Murphy says "let us see all the evidence, HairCurtains!!!!"

    She says what about the moutain of evidence pointing towards the Ramseys?

    I say, why are they forgetting Patsy's fibers all over that "garrotte"? Among a million other things. Look at John Mark Karr and Lacey. She did so well with that fiasco. Bullsmit.
    I despise the Ramseys and this is just my opinion

  12. #60
    RiverRat's Avatar
    RiverRat is offline FFJ Sr. Member Extraordinaire (Pictured at Left is Patsy Ramsey)
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    Default In my email...

    Hey River,

    Boulder DA Mary Lacy has vindicated John and Patsy Ramsey in the murder case of their daughter, JonBenet, due to what she calls new DNA evidence in the case.

    But Dan, Craig and Peter think differently. Their concensus: 'It's crap!'

    Click here to listen to their discussion. http://www.khow.com/cc-common/mainhe...rticle=3747424

    KHOW.com Webmaster,
    Matthew Quane
    "Don't play dumb with me, RR! You're no good at it." The Punisher

    "Although no one is anticipating a prompt resolution to this long and much-detoured case, perhaps - just perhaps - might we see one of those moments “when a chance arrow of history scores a perfect bullseye on a deserving target”? Steve Thomas 2009

    "Justice hasn't had a chance so far. Anyone who doesn't have this as their prime goal, we'll have a falling out with." Fleet White - Time Magazine

    "What happens is that evil comes in," Fleet says. "If you don't have truth, all you have are lies, then what comes in is evil. And evil just does its thing. In the Ramsey case, it just did its thing, and it's eaten up so many people."



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