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  1. #1

    Default JB's blood on the pillowcase...

    It has finally occurred to me that Haney was OBSESSED with the pillow/pillowcase on JonBenet's bed when he questioned Patsy in 1998. And now I know WHY.

    I know this is dumb of me, but I couldn't remember this "stain on the pillowcase" issue discussed before. I'm sure it has been, but I've missed it, obviously. Is this "DNA-X"?

    Is the stain identified as JonBenet's blood, on her pillowcase, on her bed?

    15 TRIP DEMUTH: Did JonBenet ever have nose

    16 bleeds at night?

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: Not that I remember.

    18 Sometimes she might pick her nose, maybe cause it to

    19 bleed, but she wouldn't have one of those, you know,

    20 dry, you know, to hold her head back kind of thing.
    Is that where the head blow happened--in her bedroom? Or the molestation? Then she bled on the pillowcase?

    The garrote handle wasn't applied until she was taken downstairs, we can deduce because of the broken paintbrush shards by the paint tray in the basement, the paintbrush shoved into her probably in the basement, as well--though that's not certain by any means, but seems logical not to break the paintbrush until after it was used to stage a "molestation"...or for a molestation, but either way, seems breaking it first would have been illogical.

    If the paintbrush was taken and used on her in the basement, then broken and used for the garrote, back to the bloodly pillowcase in the bedroom: therefore, the blood from her nose/mouth wouldn't have come from strangulation with the garrote until she was taken to the basement, it seems logical to me. If that blood came from her nose, it would have been from the headblow...? Or it could have come from her being molested in her bed. That would account for the issue of the girls size 12/14 Bloomies underwear, too large but being used as the ones she had on were hidden/taken away with other items out of fear they contained evidence against the person molesting her?

    So...the curtain sash over the headboard...the pillow at the foot of the bed...the pillowcase with JonBenet's blood on it.... If I'm reading this correctly, she was either molested in her bed and that's how the blood got on the pillowcase, or she was first attacked in her bedroom and/or taken to her bed at some point after the head blow...?

    Am I completely off here? Or were Haney and DeMuth indicating the pillowcase "stain" was urine? Then why ask about NOSEBLEED?

    I can't believe I have missed this "stain" on the pillowcase all these years. I almost think I remember this being discussed, but in the myraid of things we've chased down in this case through so many discussions, I've forgotten and/or never followed up on it....

    Gosh, seems darn important! Anyone, just jump in and help the old lady out! :stupid1:

    http://www.jonbenetindexguide.com/19...w-Complete.htm


    22 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, this is

    23 JonBenet's bedroom and this is the door outside

    24 to outside little den. Her bathroom would have

    25 been back behind the door. This is the bed she

    0242

    1 was sleeping in. This is the second twin bed.

    2 THOMAS HANEY: Are there any other

    3 things in photo number 1 that you can identify,

    4 say on top of this trunk there is some blue

    5 clothing item. Light blue.

    6 PATSY RAMSEY: (INAUDIBLE

    7 RESPONSE.)

    8 THOMAS HANEY: Also at the foot of

    9 the bed, it's kind of hard to tell, it looks

    10 like --

    11 PATSY RAMSEY: I need my glasses.

    12 TRIP DeMUTH: You can also take

    13 that picture out of there. There is some glare

    14 from the plastic.?

    15 PATSY RAMSEY: It looks like --

    16 this is like a pillow case or sheets or

    17 something. (INAUDIBLE.) It was kind of an

    18 (INAUDIBLE).

    19 THOMAS HANEY: Anything else that

    20 shows in that?

    21 Okay. How about number 2?

    22 PATSY RAMSEY: Oh, see, that's the

    23 pillow there.

    24 THOMAS HANEY: Okay.

    25 PATSY RAMSEY: Her Christmas

    0243

    1 sweater.

    2 THOMAS HANEY: When is the last

    3 time she wore the Christmas sweater?

    4 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't know

    5 exactly.

    6 THOMAS HANEY: Would that be where

    7 it would end up?

    8 PATSY RAMSEY: Uh-hum.

    9 THOMAS HANEY: So not unusual?

    10 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

    11 THOMAS HANEY: Okay. And you're

    12 pointing in number 2 to this pink clothing item?

    13 PATSY RAMSEY: Uh-hum.

    14 THOMAS HANEY: Can you identify

    15 that?

    16 TRIP DeMUTH: You can see it better

    17 on photo 3.

    18 PATSY RAMSEY: Oh, okay. That's

    19 the -- looks like a little pink pajama top, with

    20 long underwear.

    21 THOMAS HANEY: Was that part of a

    22 set of --

    23 PATSY RAMSEY: Yes.

    24 THOMAS HANEY: -- tops and bottoms?

    25 PATSY RAMSEY: Top and bottom,

    0244

    1 yeah.

    2 THOMAS HANEY: And that, does that

    3 appear to be one or the other?

    4 PATSY RAMSEY: It looks sort of

    5 like the top, because there is a little tag,

    6 might be at the neck, you know. It may be

    7 inside-out.

    8 THOMAS HANEY: And if you can, do

    9 you know when JonBenet would have last worn

    10 that?

    11 PATSY RAMSEY: I know she wore it,

    12 she had this on Christmas Day.

    13 THOMAS HANEY: Okay.

    14 PATSY RAMSEY: You know, like when

    15 you get up for Santa Claus.

    16 THOMAS HANEY: Okay.

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: That day.

    18 THOMAS HANEY: All right.

    19 PATSY RAMSEY: She did not wear it

    20 Christmas night, you know.

    21 THOMAS HANEY: So when you put her

    22 to bed, on Christmas night, do you recall, would

    23 that or could that have been in the bed?

    24 PATSY RAMSEY: It could have been

    25 under the pillow or something, you know.

    0245

    1 THOMAS HANEY: Was there a regular

    2 routine with dirty laundry or a hamper or toss

    3 it out the door to the laundry area or --

    4 PATSY RAMSEY: (Shaking head.) No.

    5 THOMAS HANEY: Okay. So it

    6 wouldn't be unusual for it --

    7 PATSY RAMSEY: No, it was

    8 definitely under the pillow, right.


    [snip]


    10 THOMAS HANEY: When you put

    11 JonBenet to bed on Christmas night, was that

    12 lightweight blanket in the bed?

    13 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't know. I

    14 can't say for sure.

    15 THOMAS HANEY: Take a second and go

    16 back to that routine that night of --

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: Oh, God. I can't

    18 remember exactly.

    19 THOMAS HANEY: But it should have

    20 been?

    21 PATSY RAMSEY: Should have been.

    22 THOMAS HANEY: Or would have been

    23 probably?

    24 PATSY RAMSEY: Probably.

    25 TRIP DeMUTH: What about the pillow

    0249

    1 at the foot of the bed, is that --

    2 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

    3 THOMAS HANEY: Did she use a

    4 pillow? Some people do, some don't.

    5 PATSY RAMSEY: No, no, she did.

    6 TRIP DeMUTH: I mean the way the

    7 sweater is thrown at the foot of the bed is not

    8 unusual, right?

    9 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

    10 TRIP DeMUTH: She would have done

    11 that?

    12 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.

    13 TRIP DeMUTH: Did she ever put her

    14 pillow at the foot of the bed, would that be

    15 usual or unusual?

    16 PATSY RAMSEY: That would be

    17 unusual.

    18 TRIP DeMUTH: What about the way

    19 that is generally made, did she make her bed?

    20 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

    21 TRIP DeMUTH: Was it usually in

    22 this condition, other than what you see with the

    23 pillow there?

    24 PATSY RAMSEY: I mean, an unmade

    25 bed is an unmade bed. I mean --

    0250

    1 TRIP DeMUTH: Nothing strikes you

    2 as being unusual about that, other than the

    3 blanket and the pillow?

    4 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.

    5 THOMAS HANEY: There is something

    6 hanging, is that a pink clothing item?

    7 PATSY RAMSEY: I think that's a

    8 little (INAUDIBLE).

    9 THOMAS HANEY: Are there items at

    10 the foot of the bed?

    11 PATSY RAMSEY: (INAUDIBLE

    12 RESPONSE.)


    [snip]


    12 TRIP DEMUTH: Let me ask you about this in

    13 125.

    14 PATSY RAMSEY: That is the (inaudible).

    15 TRIP DEMUTH: Is that unusual to be hanging

    16 over the door?

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah. Usually they are kind

    18 of tucked back.

    19 TRIP DEMUTH: Five and four.

    20 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah.

    21 TOM HANEY: That is the material that pulls

    22 the drapery, it pulls it back.

    23 PATSY RAMSEY: Right. I don't see any blood

    24 or anything, do you?



    [snip]


    7 TRIP DEMUTH: Looking at picture 145.

    8 PATSY RAMSEY: Okay. What is this pink --

    9 what is that?

    10 TOM HANEY: We will show you a photo of that

    11 in just a second. Just want to get through some of

    12 these first of the blanket itself.

    13 PATSY RAMSEY: This looks a little --

    14 (inaudible).

    15 TRIP DEMUTH: This was sent to CES, so every

    16 piece of trace evidence that was ever collected by a

    17 lab, so all of that is going to be documented. Our

    18 main concern is that you believe this is JonBenet's

    19 blanket on her bed.

    20 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah.

    21 TOM HANEY: This is the pink -- excuse me --

    22 the pink item that again is in a plastic bag where the

    23 photo was taken.

    24 PATSY RAMSEY: That is her (inaudible). Why

    25 was that there?

    0383

    1 TOM HANEY: What is it?

    2 PATSY RAMSEY: It is her Barbie nightgown.

    3 TOM HANEY: Is that hers or her Barbie

    4 doll's? When would she have worn that last, do you

    5 know?

    6 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, she didn't wear it that

    7 night because she had her -- she had the long underwear

    8 pants and her little white shirt. And the night before

    9 on Christmas Eve night she wore the pink little

    10 (inaudible) that was under her pillow. You saw that.

    11 And before that I don't remember. But neither of those

    12 two nights she wore that.

    13 TOM HANEY: Where would this particular --

    14 well, let me back up.

    15 Does this item have some particular

    16 significance?

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: No. No.

    18 TOM HANEY: How many nightgowns did she have?

    19 PATSY RAMSEY: A lot.

    20 TOM HANEY: Twenty, 30?

    21 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, 10 or so.

    22 TOM HANEY: Did this one have some particular

    23 significance?

    24 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

    25 TOM HANEY: Do you remember who gave it to

    0384

    1 her?

    2 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

    [snip]

    18 TOM HANEY: Did you have a particular stuffed

    19 animal, blanket, toy, whatever, that she took to bed?

    20 PATSY RAMSEY: She had a kitten we called

    21 Sister Socks. It is a gray and white stuffed animal

    22 that she liked the best.

    23 TOM HANEY: Inseparable or she just liked --

    24 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, not really inseparable,

    25 but she liked that pretty much all the time.

    0389

    1 TOM HANEY: Some kids can't go to bed --

    2 PATSY RAMSEY: No. She wasn't like that.

    3 TOM HANEY: Okay. Without something,

    4 somebody to talk to, somebody to keep them company.

    5 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

    6 TOM HANEY: No, okay. Could this have been

    7 under the pillow? Would you have noticed anything like

    8 that?

    9 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, I didn't notice the pink

    10 shirt under there, you know, so, I just don't remember

    11 where that was or the last time she wore it.

    12 TOM HANEY: Or where she got it, from whom?

    13 PATSY RAMSEY: Can't remember.


    [snip]



    16 TOM HANEY: That is 73, 74, 75, and 76 now.

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: (Inaudible).

    18 TOM HANEY: That I couldn't tell you right at

    19 this moment. Do you remember any staining on that

    20 pillow the night you put her to bed?

    21 PATSY RAMSEY: No. It was dark in there, you

    22 know.

    23 TOM HANEY: When you put her to bed did you

    24 turn on any lights that night, Christmas night.

    25 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't think so. Maybe. I

    0426

    1 can't remember. I remember dressing her, her pajamas

    2 pants on her. It was dark. I didn't turn on the

    3 bright lights because I didn't want to wake her up.

    4 TOM HANEY: But back up. John had carried

    5 her up and put her on the bed, and then you took it

    6 from there?

    7 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.

    8 TOM HANEY: But you never turned on the

    9 light?

    10 PATSY RAMSEY: I probably turned one on in

    11 the bathroom looking for the pajamas. I would have

    12 been in there.

    13 TOM HANEY: How about this pillow, when is

    14 the last time in the daytime would you have some time

    15 on Christmas day gone in there to put away Christmas

    16 presents, to do anything?

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't remember.

    18 TOM HANEY: How often would say the pillow

    19 case would be changed?

    20 PATSY RAMSEY: At least once a week.

    21 TOM HANEY: Okay. How about the rest of the

    22 day, the bottom tucked in sheets.

    23 PATSY RAMSEY: At least once a week.

    24 TOM HANEY: Was there a particular day of the

    25 week that --

    0427

    1 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't remember.

    2 TOM HANEY: Okay. I mean, some folks are

    3 pretty much on a schedule.

    4 PATSY RAMSEY: I'm pretty laid back.

    5 TOM HANEY: How about Linda?

    6 PATSY RAMSEY: I know she did it once a week.

    7 I don't know what day she did it.

    8 TOM HANEY: So this particular sheet could be

    9 on its last day of the seven or -- the holiday it could

    10 be --

    11 PATSY RAMSEY: Longer.

    12 TOM HANEY: Was she expected to come in that

    13 day?

    14 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

    15 TOM HANEY: 26th.

    16 PATSY RAMSEY: She was supposed to come in.

    17 She was going to come on Friday. Wednesday was

    18 Christmas, so she was off on Christmas. She came

    19 Monday, Wednesday and Friday. She was there Monday

    20 because she helped me get ready for the party.

    21 TOM HANEY: When you were getting ready for

    22 the party did she do the laundry?

    23 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't know. We were getting

    24 ready for the party, you know.

    25 TOM HANEY: Right.

    0428

    1 PATSY RAMSEY: Downstairs. She didn't come

    2 Wednesday because it was Christmas. She was going to

    3 come Friday after we had gone, and I left her a check

    4 because she (inaudible) cried she wanted money.

    5 TOM HANEY: But if she comes Monday,

    6 Wednesday and Friday, and obviously doesn't come

    7 because of Christmas on Wednesday, we have the sheets

    8 on at a minimum, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, so three

    9 days.

    10 PATSY RAMSEY: Probably.

    11 TOM HANEY: The maximum number going back.

    12 PATSY RAMSEY: Maybe the next Friday.

    13 TOM HANEY: Or last Wednesday.

    14 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.

    15 TRIP DEMUTH: Did JonBenet ever have nose

    16 bleeds at night?

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: Not that I remember.

    18 Sometimes she might pick her nose, maybe cause it to

    19 bleed, but she wouldn't have one of those, you know,

    20 dry, you know, to hold her head back kind of thing.


    21 TOM HANEY: How are we doing?

    22 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't know about you, but I

    23 am exhausted.

    24 TRIP DEMUTH: Can we go off the tape?

    25 (Whereupon, a break was taken and an off the record

    [snip]

    12 TOM HANEY: Do you recall if she

    13 wet the bed on Christmas Eve, to Christmas

    14 morning?

    15 PATSY RAMSEY: No, no, she did

    16 not.

    17 TOM HANEY: How about going back

    18 from then, from Christmas morning, do you recall

    19 when the last time she was wet? Because we

    20 talked yesterday about the changing of the

    21 linen, the sheets, and we couldn't really pin

    22 that down.

    23 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.

    24 TOM HANEY: Okay. But if there

    25 were several stains on there and we figured it

    0568

    1 was around, if the maximum a week since the

    2 linen was changed, would that indicate to you

    3 wetting more than once, or--

    4 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, that was

    5 (INAUDIBLE).

    6 TOM HANEY: Right we were looking

    7 at the pillow case, but we were also talking

    8 about all of the bedding and how often it got

    9 laundered and--

    10 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, that got

    11 changed once a week, unless she wet the bed and

    12 then of course it would be changed, you know.

    13 TOM HANEY: Did you check the bed

    14 on say Christmas day, morning?

    15 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah. (INAUDIBLE).

    16 TOM HANEY: Okay. But you

    17 distinctly remember going and checking on that?

    18 PATSY RAMSEY: Plus she had her

    19 pink pajamas on that she had put on the night

    20 before. If she had wet it would have been

    21 soaking wet and she wouldn't have had those on

    22 in the Christmas picture, so --

    23 TOM HANEY: Okay. If that's what

    24 she, and you say that's what she wore to bed the

    25 night before?

    0569

    1 PATSY RAMSEY: Yes.
    Last edited by koldkase; November 22, 2008, 5:08 pm at Sat Nov 22 17:08:54 UTC 2008.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

    ~~~~~~~
    Bloomies underwear model:
    3 Dimensional

    ~~~~~~
    My opinions, nothing more.

  2. #2

    Default

    Okay, if you're a REAL glutton for punishment--and why would ANY of us STILL be here if we weren't--here is Lin Wood torturing Mark Beckner in his Wolf suit deposition, hammering Beckner about the "DNAX". Notice that Beckner says the "DNAX" hadn't been found before the grand jury convened in September of '98. John and Patsy were interviewed by DA Hunter's detectives in June of '98. So...just where did this DNAX come from and when was it found? Was it found during grand jury proceedings? Did the grand jury ask for some items to be tested that hadn't been before? Or was it independent of the grand jury? Beckner was being questioned in Nov. 2001.

    Do I remember some people discussing blood on the nightgown or blanket? But I don't believe I ever saw that sourced. Maybe that's why I don't remember it that well.

    If anyone can clarify, thanks in advance.


    10 Q Do you know whether DNA -- I believe you

    11 told me DNA tests were done or were performed with

    12 respect to Chris Wolf?

    13 A Yes; to the best of my recollection, yes.

    14 Q Do you know the results?

    15 A Yes.

    16 Q What were the results?

    17 A He did not match the DNA from the scene.

    18 Q Has anyone matched the DNA from the scene?

    19 A No.

    20 Q Can you give me a ballpark figure of how

    21 many individuals have submitted DNA?

    22 A Well, back up a minute. There is more

    23 than one sample of DNA. So specifically what are you

    24 referring to?

    25 Q Well, as I understand it, there is DNA and




    121



    1 I don't want to get technical here, but I understand

    2 there was DNA found, foreign DNA, found under the

    3 fingernails on JonBent's left and right hands; am I

    4 right?

    5 A Okay. Yes.

    6 Q As I understand it, there was foreign DNA

    7 found either on -- I'll just say on her underwear?

    8 A Yes.

    9 Q Now, I'm not aware as I sit here of any

    10 other DNA. Was there any other?

    11 A Yes.

    12 Q Where was it?

    13 A Well --

    14 MR. MILLER: Just a minute.

    15 THE DEPONENT: Yeah. We're getting into

    16 evidence here.

    17 MR. MILLER: I don't think you should

    18 answer that question.


    19 Q (BY MR. WOOD) I have to be able to know.

    20 You raised the issue yourself about the different

    21 areas of DNA. So I assume it has some relevance to

    22 the subject matter that I'm asking you about in terms

    23 of the tests done with Chris Wolf.

    24 A You can certainly ask me if Chris Wolf

    25 matched any DNA at the scene. I can answer that.




    122



    1 Q But I'm asking you about -- but I asked

    2 you whether anyone else's did and you indicated

    3 initially no. I said Do you know whether DNA -- I

    4 believe you told me DNA tests were done or performed

    5 with respect to Chris Wolf?

    6 Yes; to the best of my recollection, yes.

    7 Do you know the results?

    8 Yes.

    9 What were the results?

    10 "Answer: He did not match the DNA from

    11 the scene.

    12 "Question: Has anyone matched the DNA

    13 from the scene?

    14 "Answer: No.

    15 "Question: Can you give me a ballpark

    16 figure of how many individuals have submitted DNA"

    17 and you didn't answer that.

    18 You said "Well, back up a minute. There

    19 is more than one sample of DNA. So specifically what

    20 are you referring to" was the question you posed to

    21 me.

    22 So that has relevance of your own inquiry

    23 and so I need to find out what other DNA you're

    24 referring to.

    25 A When you asked the question, I'm thinking




    123



    1 the unknown DNA.

    2 Q Well, I mean --

    3 A I answered the question in that context.

    4 Q Known DNA -- I'm talking about DNA foreign

    5 to JonBent.

    6 A Okay.

    7 Q That's what I'm asking you about and

    8 whether any of that has been matched, DNA found on

    9 her, foreign to her, whether that was matched to

    10 Chris Wolf?

    11 A DNA found on her?

    12 Q Or on her clothing.

    13 A And the question is did that match to

    14 Chris Wolf? The answer is no.

    15 Q Has it matched, been matched to anyone?

    16 A The DNA on JonBent?

    17 Q And/or on her clothing?

    18 A No.

    19 Q Obviously you're telling me there was DNA

    20 that was not on JonBen t or on her clothing; is that

    21 correct?

    22 A Correct.

    23 Q Where was that?

    24 A We're getting into areas where I feel like

    25 we can't go.




    124



    1 Q Well, I'm trying to figure out what was

    2 done with Chris Wolf, and then obviously I'm trying

    3 to find out if it's been matched with anyone since

    4 that's the larger picture of the case in its

    5 entirety. But I don't know what I'm getting if I

    6 don't know what I'm asking about.
    [That Wood is a barrel of laughs. ] You raised the

    7 question, you've indicated there was DNA that was

    8 found somewhere other than on her body or on her

    9 clothing.

    10 I had initially asked you about the crime

    11 scene, I thought. Pull that back up. I asked you

    12 specifically, you did not match the DNA from the

    13 scene? Answer --

    14 "Question: Has anyone matched the DNA

    15 from the scene?

    16 "Answer: No."

    17 And you seem to be telling me now that you

    18 want to modify that answer, that there was DNA from

    19 the scene foreign to JonBent. And I'm asking you

    20 where?

    21 A What I'm saying is I am getting into

    22 evidence that goes beyond Chris Wolf.

    23 Q Well, was Chris Wolf's -- was Chris Wolf's

    24 DNA tested against this other DNA that you say was

    25 found at the scene that you don't want to tell me




    125



    1 about?

    2 A Well, that wouldn't be accurate. Compared

    3 against would be the accurate question.

    4 Q Well, was it compared against?

    5 A Yes.

    6 Q Why would it be compared against if it had

    7 already been identified as known?

    8 A Well, again --

    9 MR. MILLER: I don't think he can answer

    10 this question.

    11 Q (BY MR. WOOD) Well, the DNA evidence from

    12 Mr. Wolf was obtained in February or March of 1998,

    13 right?

    14 A To the best of my recollection, yes.

    15 Q Why would you have tested it, and maybe

    16 you didn't, why would you have tested it against

    17 foreign DNA that you had already had a match on from

    18 someone else?

    19 MR. MILLER: He didn't say he already had

    20 a match on. That's why --

    21 MR. WOOD: I may have been reading too

    22 much in because he made reference to known DNA. And

    23 I thought he was -- I was assuming that maybe they

    24 had gotten a match and you knew the source.

    25 A We have JonBent's DNA; that's known DNA.




    126



    1 Q (BY MR. WOOD) Right. And then you have

    2 foreign DNA?

    3 A Yes.

    4 Q And the question was has any of the

    5 foreign DNA, foreign to JonBen t, you have indicated

    6 to me has not been matched to Chris Wolf?

    7 A Correct.

    8 Q And I asked you had it been matched to

    9 anyone and you initially said no; is that correct?

    10 A The DNA on her body or clothing, the

    11 answer is no; that's right.

    12 Q What about the crime scene?

    13 A That's what I can't answer.

    14 Q But here is the dilemma. I want to know

    15 if whatever this we'll call it DNAX, okay, was Chris

    16 Wolf's DNA compared to DNAX?

    17 MR. MILLER: He answered that yes.

    18 A Yes.

    19 Q (BY MR. WOOD) Okay.

    20 A I can tell you it does not match DNAX.

    21 Q Right. At the time that Chris Wolf's DNA

    22 was compared to DNAX, had it been compared to any

    23 other DNA and found to be a match?

    24 A Compared with other -- no, it's not

    25 been -- his DNA has not been matched to anything at




    127



    1 the crime scene.

    2 Q But the DNAX at the time that you compared

    3 Chris Wolf's DNA to the DNAX, had you compared the

    4 DNAX to other individual's DNA and found there to be

    5 a match or been able to identify whose DNA it was?

    6 A Well, you're time line is all way off

    7 base.

    8 Q Well, my time line is limited to the

    9 moment --

    10 A Yeah.

    11 Q -- to the fact that you took the DNA from

    12 Chris Wolf, you obtained it in February or March of

    13 1998.

    14 A And we did not have DNAX at that time.

    15 Q So DNAX came along subsequent in time?

    16 A Yes.


    17 Q And when it came along, was Chris Wolf's

    18 DNA which had been kept on file, right, you maintain

    19 it?

    20 A Um-hum.

    21 Q Was it compared to DNAX?

    22 A The lab would have to answer that.

    23 Q Well, would you have expected it to be?

    24 A Not necessarily.

    25 Q Why?




    128



    1 A Well, if -- hypothetically?

    2 MR. MILLER: No, not hypothetically.

    3 Q (BY MR. WOOD) I would rather you --

    4 A I don't know how to answer it without

    5 giving away information.

    6 MR. MILLER: Well, then don't answer it.

    7 Then don't answer it.

    8 Q (BY MR. WOOD) You know, part of the

    9 process here is going to require you ultimately to

    10 give away information.

    11 MR. MILLER: He doesn't have to give away

    12 information that is related to the ongoing

    13 investigation and that's really the key here.

    14 MR. WOOD: Well, unfortunately that's the

    15 argument we will have.

    16 MR. MILLER: That's the --

    17 MR. WOOD: I'm defending clients on a

    18 murder charge in a civil case.

    19 MR. MILLER: Well, you're not really.

    20 You've got a civil case --

    21 MR. WOOD: Yes, I am.

    22 MR. MILLER: You've got a civil case and--

    23 MR. WOOD: Where the allegation is murder.

    24 MR. MILLER: Well, you've got a -- you

    25 could classify it that way. The legal claims are not




    129



    1 murder.

    2 MR. WOOD: Let me just tell you that Judge

    3 Julian Korns, a former United States attorney, as you

    4 have been, has clearly characterized this as a

    5 defense against a charge of murder. And I have the

    6 transcript to show that to you.

    7 MR. MILLER: Well --

    8 MR. WOOD: And the point is, we don't need

    9 to argue about it today. But I am being met with a

    10 lawsuit that is in fact supported in part by Boulder

    11 police detectives or former Boulder police detectives

    12 as witnesses and information leaked and provided to

    13 the public, the media from the Boulder Police

    14 Department as part of the basis of Darnay Hoffman's

    15 case against my client. It may be painful down the

    16 road for information to come out but that's just the

    17 way things may have to be.

    18 Q (BY MR. WOOD) The point here is maybe

    19 this will at least help us know if it's a total waste

    20 of time. Was DNAX obtained before or after Chris

    21 Wolf was cleared from under the umbrella of

    22 suspicion?

    23 A I would have to go back and look and see

    24 what the time frames were.

    25 Q Was the DNAX discovered prior to June of




    130



    1 1998 when the VIP presentations I have called it or

    2 it's been referred to was made?

    3 A No.

    4 Q Do you know in relationship to the grand

    5 jury whether it had been discovered prior to the

    6 grand jury convening in September, I believe, of

    7 1998?

    8 A Prior to?

    9 Q Yes.

    10 A I don't believe so.


    11 Q So does that help you relate to Chris Wolf

    12 how it might time out?

    13 A Yeah, it probably would have been

    14 afterwards time-wise.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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    Thumbs up

    First of all......you are most likely on the right track!

    Second.....I have now read enough "I don't remember's" to make my head throb and reminds me of why it would have been very hard for Patsy to have made me more disgusted than she did.

    Third - Bravo!
    "Don't play dumb with me, RR! You're no good at it." The Punisher

    "Although no one is anticipating a prompt resolution to this long and much-detoured case, perhaps - just perhaps - might we see one of those moments “when a chance arrow of history scores a perfect bullseye on a deserving target”? Steve Thomas 2009

    "Justice hasn't had a chance so far. Anyone who doesn't have this as their prime goal, we'll have a falling out with." Fleet White - Time Magazine

    "What happens is that evil comes in," Fleet says. "If you don't have truth, all you have are lies, then what comes in is evil. And evil just does its thing. In the Ramsey case, it just did its thing, and it's eaten up so many people."

  4. #4

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    It certainly looks to me like LE knew something happened in that bedroom.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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  5. #5

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    Didn't I also read somewhere that there were pieces of the garrote in JB's bed?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase View Post
    It certainly looks to me like LE knew something happened in that bedroom.
    It certainly does look this way KK. It is frustrating going over this Patsy interview again. Patsy got away with murder in more ways than one.

    I would like to give a good hard slap to Lin Wood's face. As Thor would say, "Arrogant bastid!"

    Thank you for this refresher.
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  7. #7

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    The Ramseys claimed, when their paperback came out, that "fibers" from the garrote and the paper bag--brought in by the intruder with the "rope" found in JAR's room--were vacuumed from JB's bed. Paper bag fibers were allegedly in the body bag with JB, as well, again "PROOF" the intruder brought them into the house with his "paper bag of rope", according to the RST.

    Judge Carnes also alludes to this in her "opinion", citing it as "evidence", and we all know it came from "Psychic" Smit's deposition in that suit.

    Only problem: Smit is on camera and transcribed telling John that the paper bag actually came FROM LE! As we all know and can SEE, that's what they use when collecting evidence. Not to mention, JONBENET'S HANDS AND FEET WERE BAGGED WITH BROWN PAPER BAGS before her body was removed. You can SEE those bags in one of the crime scene photos released by..."PSYCHIC" SMIT! And if that's not enough for you, THE MEDICAL EXAMINER LISTS THE PAPER BAGS ON THE BODY IN THE AUTOPSY!

    Anywho...then someone...Carnes?...listed ONE CORD FIBER was in the vacuumings from the bed. Think about that. Could that one cord fiber have gotten into bed vacuumings through transference? If John and/or Patsy actually tied that cord on JonBenet in the basement, they also were upstairs in the bedroom when LE was there, as John "looked" under the bed with LE in the room, if memory serves...?

    Just saying, maybe the garrote was tied on the child in her own bed. Maybe not. Even a few cord fibers are not hard to transfer on clothes, hands, etc.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karen View Post
    Didn't I also read somewhere that there were pieces of the garrote in JB's bed?
    The fibers is ringing a bell.....

    See?! This is why we all need to go back and unlock all that we have taken in over these long years.......

    I am soooo wishing that we could have a newspaper like the Orlando Sentinal in Boulder. I am more than jealous with the Anthony Case and all Public Information files that are released almost weekly! OPEN these dammmn files finally!!!
    "Don't play dumb with me, RR! You're no good at it." The Punisher

    "Although no one is anticipating a prompt resolution to this long and much-detoured case, perhaps - just perhaps - might we see one of those moments “when a chance arrow of history scores a perfect bullseye on a deserving target”? Steve Thomas 2009

    "Justice hasn't had a chance so far. Anyone who doesn't have this as their prime goal, we'll have a falling out with." Fleet White - Time Magazine

    "What happens is that evil comes in," Fleet says. "If you don't have truth, all you have are lies, then what comes in is evil. And evil just does its thing. In the Ramsey case, it just did its thing, and it's eaten up so many people."

  9. #9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverRat View Post
    The fibers is ringing a bell.....

    See?! This is why we all need to go back and unlock all that we have taken in over these long years.......

    I am soooo wishing that we could have a newspaper like the Orlando Sentinal in Boulder. I am more than jealous with the Anthony Case and all Public Information files that are released almost weekly! OPEN these dammmn files finally!!!
    HA! Don't hold your breath! Opening the files of this case...to anyone but the RST, of course...would simply expose the huge corruption and obstruction coming STRAIGHT out of the DA's Office starting with Alex "Hot Tub" Hunter.

    I expect the new DA to bury this as fast and deep as he can dig.

    On the other hand, the surprises in this case never seem to stop. Who knows? He might actually be ethical (or stupid, depending on your point of view) enough to do the right thing!

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
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  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elle_1 View Post
    It certainly does look this way KK. It is frustrating going over this Patsy interview again. Patsy got away with murder in more ways than one.
    Knowing what I know of Haney, I doubt he said anything ulness it had a specific purpose.

    I would like to give a good hard slap to Lin Wood's face. As Thor would say, "Arrogant bastid!"[/QUOTE]

    Lucky for him he's not dealing with me. I'd give him a lot worse than that!
    They should all drown in lakes of blood. Now they will know why they are afraid of the dark. Now they will learn why they fear the night.

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase View Post
    It certainly looks to me like LE knew something happened in that bedroom.
    And Patsy knew it too!! OMG, what slip-up she made when telling Haney - out of the blue!! - that she couldn't see blood on the drapery.
    But the topic of blood possibly being on the drapery had not even been raised.
    And Haney let it slide.
    He did not dig further by asking for example:
    "Patsy, what makes you think blood might have been on the drapery?"

    Patsy knew JonBenet bled in that room, no question about it imo. Probably from the head blow, where blood could have dripped from her nose. Patsy probably was concerned about this blood either having sprayed to the draperies or to her accidentally having transferred it to the drapery when moving around in a panic after the head blow had been struck.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karen View Post
    Didn't I also read somewhere that there were pieces of the garrote in JB's bed?
    I vaguely recall Carnes' report mentioning that fibers from a rope were found in JonBenet's bed, but it seems they were from the hemp rope found in JAR's bedroom, and not from the nylon cord which was tied around the victim's neck.



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