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  1. #1

    Default The interloping rope

    From the Carnes ofder, pg. 72:
    "Likewise, other items not belonging on the second floor were found there on the day after the murder, thereby suggesting that some preparation or activity was ongoing in that area on the night of the murder. Specifically, a rope was found inside a brown paper sack in the guest bedroom on the second floor; defendants have indicated that neither of these items belonged to them. (SMF 181; PSMF 181.) Regardless of its ownership, there is no explanation why a bag containing a rope would be in the guest bedroom."

    I know this rope is one of Lou Smit's favorite things. He "knows" it doesn't belong to the Ramseys. But it appears that JonBenet had her picture taken with it once.

    You can see the end of the rope near JonBenet's ankle in the lower right-hand corner.
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  2. #2
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    Correct you are. And though this wasn't brought put much- Patsy had an interview with a local publication just before the "Colorado Christmas" house tour. In that interview, she mentions that she had a decorated tree in every bedroom. That "spare room" belonged to JAR. He slept there when he was home from college on weekends. Though he lived with his mother in Atlanta, he attended college right there in Boulder.
    Patsy mentioned that each room had a tree decorated in a theme particular to that person. JAR was into all things "Western", so his tree had miniature cowboy boots and hats. And a "lasso" rope as garland...
    This is my Constitutionally protected OPINION. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee View Post
    Correct you are. And though this wasn't brought put much- Patsy had an interview with a local publication just before the "Colorado Christmas" house tour. In that interview, she mentions that she had a decorated tree in every bedroom. That "spare room" belonged to JAR. He slept there when he was home from college on weekends. Though he lived with his mother in Atlanta, he attended college right there in Boulder.
    Patsy mentioned that each room had a tree decorated in a theme particular to that person. JAR was into all things "Western", so his tree had miniature cowboy boots and hats. And a "lasso" rope as garland...
    Patsy said she'd never seen ends done like that. I guess she forgot JonBenet's cowgirl picture.

    But to give her credit, she waffles a bit on the rope and says to ask John Andrew. As I recall, John didn't give an opinion one way or the other.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee View Post
    Patsy mentioned that each room had a tree decorated in a theme particular to that person. JAR was into all things "Western", so his tree had miniature cowboy boots and hats. And a "lasso" rope as garland...
    Does that explain why the rope was in a paper bag?

    Or was the mysterious paper bag just a bag used for transporting evidence?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fr brown View Post
    Does that explain why the rope was in a paper bag?

    Or was the mysterious paper bag just a bag used for transporting evidence?
    Don't know. It is unlikely that a paper bag would be used to transport the evidence, more likely a plastic bag. I recall that the rope was found IN the paper bag. JB was photographed with an identical rope in one of her photo shoots. If a length or rope was brought home from the store in a paper bag, it may simply have been kept in the bag. If the rope was used on the tree in JAR's room, the remainder may have simply been left there. The whole family was notorious for never putting things back in their place. Even Patsy's mother Nedra used to criticize her for it.
    This is my Constitutionally protected OPINION. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee View Post
    Don't know. It is unlikely that a paper bag would be used to transport the evidence, more likely a plastic bag. I recall that the rope was found IN the paper bag. JB was photographed with an identical rope in one of her photo shoots. If a length or rope was brought home from the store in a paper bag, it may simply have been kept in the bag. If the rope was used on the tree in JAR's room, the remainder may have simply been left there. The whole family was notorious for never putting things back in their place. Even Patsy's mother Nedra used to criticize her for it.
    I looked on the net and they do sell brown paper bags for evidence collection. And I think they put brown paper bags over JonBenet's hands before they transported her body.

  7. #7
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    Paper bags are used all the time for collecting evidence, just look at any of the stories/pictures/videos on-line where they show a house from which they are removing evidence...what is shown is almost always brown paper bags. Michael Jackson, Casey Anthony are the two most recent where I have seen that.
    It's probably too late to get justice for JonBenét. Maybe it always was. But knowing where things went wrong is the first step to not going there again. **-- Alan Prendergast-Dec 21, 2006--**

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    If that's the case then the rope could have been put in the bag by whoever took it into evidence. I had read long ago that it was found in the bag, but there were a lot of misstatements in this case, as we know.
    This is my Constitutionally protected OPINION. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  9. #9

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    Oh, the disinfo about the "rope in a paper bag" has been a real tail-chaser, thanks to the RST, as per usual. But dear old ACandyRose cleared it up for us. God bless her.

    Here's a thread on it where we discussed it about two years ago, which might be informative for y'all:

    http://www.forumsforjustice.org/foru...ead.php?t=9034

    Here is the ACR link with her breakdown of the facts:

    http://www.acandyrose.com/s-evidence-bedroom-JAR.htm

    From the police depo's of Patsy and John in '98:

    (0535-16) LOU SMIT: But he could have had things there in his backpack? JOHN RAMSEY: It wouldn't have been out of the question. LOU SMIT: Just for the camera, the photographs we are looking at is photo 113, 114, 115 and 116. - (0535-24) BRYAN MORGAN: May I ask just one question. Can you tell us if this is the form in which it was originally found? LOU SMIT: No, that's the bag it was put in for evidence. BRYAN MORGAN: So the paper bag is just in evidence. LOU SMIT: Evidence bag. And again that was just found in the room, and it was found in a bag in her room, that's all I can tell you at this time.
    (0519-07) TOM HANEY: Next we have photos that are numbered 113. PATSY RAMSEY: Uh-huh (yes). TOM HANEY: Which is a paper bag. PATSY RAMSEY: Uh-huh (yes). TOM HANEY: And then 114 is the contents of that. TRIP DeMUTH: The paper bag is a police bag and this came out of here. PATSY RAMSEY: Oh, this was in here? TRIP DeMUTH: Correct? PATSY RAMSEY: Oh. TRIP DeMUTH: And there's another picture of that same item in 115 and 116. Why don't you look those over at your leisure. PATSY RAMSEY: I don't recognize it, specifically.
    (0520-01) TOM HANEY: Okay. And that, that particular piece of rope, do you ever remember seeing anything like it around? And if you look at photo 115, you notice the -- PATSY RAMSEY: Right. TOM HANEY: -- ends are unusually secured. PATSY RAMSEY: Right. No. TOM HANEY: Can you think of any reason to have that kind of rope around? PATSY RAMSEY: I've just never seen ends like that, done like that. John had some, you know, boat ropes and things up at the lake, but it seems like when they cut those, they kind of melt the ends of them or something to keep them from fraying or something. I've never seen one done like that.
    [Another little bonus ACR points out is that Patsy Ramsey told Haney that the bed was too low to put things under. Guess they better add to that profile of Smit's intruder that he's extremely thin.]

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase View Post
    Another little bonus ACR points out is that Patsy Ramsey told Haney that the bed was too low to put things under. Guess they better add to that profile of Smit's intruder that he's extremely thin.
    I got it, I got it...it is Flat Stanley or Flat Stella, or both!
    http://www.pleasanton.k12.ca.us/vall...e/stanley.html
    It's probably too late to get justice for JonBenét. Maybe it always was. But knowing where things went wrong is the first step to not going there again. **-- Alan Prendergast-Dec 21, 2006--**

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  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by koldkase View Post
    Oh, the disinfo about the "rope in a paper bag" has been a real tail-chaser, thanks to the RST, as per usual. But dear old ACandyRose cleared it up for us. God bless her....
    [Another little bonus ACR points out is that Patsy Ramsey told Haney that the bed was too low to put things under. Guess they better add to that profile of Smit's intruder that he's extremely thin.]
    If the paper bag was just an evidence bag then why in blazes are Smit and Lin Wood presenting it to Carnes this way:

    "Likewise, other items not belonging on the second floor were found there on the day after the murder, thereby suggesting that some preparation or activity was ongoing in that area on the night of the murder. Specifically, a rope was found inside a brown paper sack in the guest bedroom on the second floor; defendants have indicated that neither of these items belonged to them. (SMF 181; PSMF 181.) Regardless of its ownership, there is no explanation why a bag containing a rope would be in the guest bedroom."

    Isn't this a fraud perpetrated on the court? I suppose Smit could claim incompetence.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by fr brown View Post
    If the paper bag was just an evidence bag then why in blazes are Smit and Lin Wood presenting it to Carnes this way:

    "Likewise, other items not belonging on the second floor were found there on the day after the murder, thereby suggesting that some preparation or activity was ongoing in that area on the night of the murder. Specifically, a rope was found inside a brown paper sack in the guest bedroom on the second floor; defendants have indicated that neither of these items belonged to them. (SMF 181; PSMF 181.) Regardless of its ownership, there is no explanation why a bag containing a rope would be in the guest bedroom."

    Isn't this a fraud perpetrated on the court? I suppose Smit could claim incompetence.
    Well, Smit would get no argument from me on his incompetence.

    Yes, this is a fraud perpetuated on the court. Unfortunately, Judge Carnes seemed to be too easy to defraud. Aside from Georiga civil law differing a great deal from the standard of evidence presented in a civil trial, remember that Lin Wood was in his own stomping grounds. Add in that Darnay STIPULATED TO ALL OF SMIT'S "EVIDENCE", meaning Darnay not only didn't contest it, he ACCEPTED IT AS TRUE ON ITS FACE FOR THE COURT, and you've got the disaster orchestrated by the wiley Wood/Ramsey team, with Darnay being run over like a deer in the headlights. Darnay thought his handwriting experts would win over the Smit disinformation campaign. Big mistake, as they never made it into evidence.

    Remember that the Wolf suit never WENT to trial. Carnes DISMISSED the suit BEFORE TRIAL when Wood made that routine motion after the discovery phase was fiinished. Carnes primarily used the depositions to write her 90 page "OPINION." Yeah, that's nothing more than AN OPINION she formulated without the so-called "evidence" ever being tested at trial. Wood played her like a fiddle. She seemed to have enjoyed it, dismissing all Darnay's handwriting experts out of hand, his best expert--impeccable Dr. Epstein, who stated hands down that PATSY WROTE THE NOTE--excluded because Epstein never saw the actual ransom note. Only the original document examiners hired by the BPD and Team Ramsey got to see that. Well, it was destroyed in processing by CBI, after all, but with Lacy holding the keys to the evidence vault, that was never going to happen anyway. Carnes saw NOTHING DIRECTLY FROM the case files, just photos Smit funneled through the PowerPoint presentation he made while working for Hunter, from the case evidence files, and then heard Smit's INTERPRETATION of them in his depo. There was no one to question any of what Smit said, and under Georgia CIVIIL LAW, if there's no rebuttal FROM OPPOSING COUNSEL to consider, any "evidence" presented to the court by either side becomes FACT. Carnes really had all the latitude she needed to write that ignorant opinion. (Ignorant because it was so full of Ramsey disinformation that was entirely false.)

    As bad as the outcome of the Wolf suit was legally (for Wolf, anyway, as it was a godsend for Team Ramsey), those of us who want to know the truth about this murder did get lots of info from the depositions we otherwise wouldn't have had. We got to see the Ramseys' many lies exposed again, as this time they were under oath! Stories changed. Patsy's memory lapses this time were even more sinister. And we got to see how pathetic Smit truly is as a detective, if not purely deceitful--and I can make an argument that he has known the truth all along and simply went along with Team Ramsey because it worked to futher his fame and ego.

    There's a lot more of that deceit you can glean from Carne's "opinion" and the depositions available from that suit. It's amazing how much disinformation Team Ramsey has put out through the years, when you look closely.

    "University of Colorado Law Professor Paul Campos declared the letter a 'reckless exoneration.' He went on to state, 'Everyone knows that relative immunity from criminal conviction is something money can buy.
    Apparently another thing it can buy is an apology for even being suspected of a crime you probably already would have been convicted of committing if you happened to be poor.'"
    FF: WRKJB?

    ~~~~~~~
    Bloomies underwear model:
    3 Dimensional

    ~~~~~~
    My opinions, nothing more.



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