Forensic Evidence 2: Bedwetting

[sue]

Originally Posted by Moab

Thanks tylin, this is entirely different from what we have been discussing, not only here, but this whole 10 years. Where does it say "dog-eared"? Which, unless I am backwards, usually happens at the top of the page. My Websters Collegiate edition was either a different sized book or a different edition since the word "incest" is the first word on the right-hand page, not the left. From what you quoted above from ST's book though it sounds to me like a large portion of the page was folded. Is that how anyone else interprets it? It would be interesting to know if any other pages from that book looked to have been folded down at some point in time.

I have a Webster's 9th Collegiate Dictionary, published in 1991.
The word "incest" is the top word in the left hand column of the right-hand page (page 609).
Since it is the top word in the first column on that page, it appears twice; once on the top of the right hand column, where a small fold over would point to it and once on the top of the left hand column, where a considerable amount of the page would have to be folded to point to it.

If the dictionary is this version of the book, I could see a possible reason why Steve might have thought it was the bottom left side page. What if he refreshed his memory by looking at a picture that was good enough resolution to see the fold, but not to read the words. If the picture was of the coffee table/area rather than the book itself, it could be possible that the picture showed the book upside down. Or, he might have been thinking of the left side column, but sort of 'translated' that in his mind to left hand page. I doubt that he had access to all the evidence while he was writing his book.
If it was a different edition, incest could have been close to the bottom of the right hand column on the left side page. It would not take too many words to bump it over if it was an earlier edition.

We can't know if it was an earlier edition, but it has to be no more than the 9th edition. According to Amazon.com's listing for the Webster's Collegiate Dictionary, the 11th edition was published in 2003

Hardcover: 1664 pages
Publisher: Merriam-Webster; 11th edition (July 2003)
Language: English
ISBN-10: 0877798087
ISBN-13: 978-0877798088
Product Dimensions: 10 x 7.3 x 2 inches

And, the 10th edition was published in 1998.
link to the 10th Edition on Amazon.
Hardcover: 1559 pages
Publisher: Merriam-Webster; 10th Indx edition (1998)
Language: English
ISBN-10: 0877797099
ISBN-13: 978-0877797098
Product Dimensions: 10 x 7.4 x 1.9 inches
Shipping Weight: 3.63 pounds

[tylin]

Sue,
THANKS for the info...that's some fine and very informative research.

[Elle_1]

Mine is ISBN 1-85534-039-9
Webster's New Dictionary and Thesaurus
Concise Edition

Published by Russell, Geddes and Grosset, Windsor Court NY USA.

Printed in the USA

Geddess and Grosset Ltd., New Lanark, Scotland. 1990 is also printed on this edition. Just if anyone is interested (?).

I should have added the information I posted before.

In my large copy of Webster Dictionary and Thesaurus (1990) the word "incest" is on page 278 and is almost half-way down the second column.

Your copy HM might have been the same edition as the Ramsey's (?). Note the difference in the page number, 912, compared to mine, page 278 for the same word "incest."

[sue]

Originally Posted by Kangatruth

anyone got access to a pre 96 edition for comparison?

Yes, I do. Steve's book does say it was the Webster's New Collegiate Dictionary, but not the edition. Comparing any other dictionary -even another Webster's will not work because the word selection, book size and type face used would be different.

Originally Posted by sue

I have a Webster's 9th Collegiate Dictionary, published in 1991.
The word "incest" is the top word in the left hand column of the right-hand page (page 609).
Since it is the top word in the first column on that page, it appears twice; once on the top of the right hand column, where a small fold over would point to it and once on the top of the left hand column, where a considerable amount of the page would have to be folded to point to it.

If the dictionary is this version of the book, I could see a possible reason why Steve might have thought it was the bottom left side page. What if he refreshed his memory by looking at a picture that was good enough resolution to see the fold, but not to read the words. If the picture was of the coffee table/area rather than the book itself, it could be possible that the picture showed the book upside down. Or, he might have been thinking of the left side column, but sort of 'translated' that in his mind to left hand page. I doubt that he had access to all the evidence while he was writing his book.
If it was a different edition, incest could have been close to the bottom of the right hand column on the left side page. It would not take too many words to bump it over if it was an earlier edition.

We can't know if it was an earlier edition, but it has to be no more than the 9th edition. According to Amazon.com's listing for the Webster's Collegiate Dictionary, the 11th edition was published in 2003

Hardcover: 1664 pages
Publisher: Merriam-Webster; 11th edition (July 2003)
Language: English
ISBN-10: 0877798087
ISBN-13: 978-0877798088
Product Dimensions: 10 x 7.3 x 2 inches

And, the 10th edition was published in 1998.
link to the 10th Edition on Amazon.
Hardcover: 1559 pages
Publisher: Merriam-Webster; 10th Indx edition (1998)
Language: English
ISBN-10: 0877797099
ISBN-13: 978-0877797098
Product Dimensions: 10 x 7.4 x 1.9 inches
Shipping Weight: 3.63 pounds

[Elle_1]

Then why are we all wasting space here?

[Moab]

Originally Posted by Elle_1

Then why are we all wasting space here?

Good question Elle!!! LOL

I have the Webster's Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary (as I have said before)- published/copyright 1983

Incest is on page 609 (a right-hand page), and it is listed twice on the page

First it is listed in the top right margin where the first/last words on the page are listed (incest-incognitant)

Second it is the first word at the top of the left-hand column

No way to dog-ear a corner of a page, (either top or bottom) to point directly at that word...and that word only!

[Paradox]

The ransom note is theatrical, as was Patsy in the 911 call, as was Patsy in inviting people to the house, as was the treatment of the body, as was leaving the washed down flashlight out in the open, as was leaving the bowl of pineapple and milk out ... ad nauseum. Marking the dictionary in such a way is typical of the afore mentioned pattern.

Just what other tidbits did Patsy leave behind that the bungleboys (and girls) in Boulder Blue overlook?

[Elle_1]

In other words, Paradox, Patsy was playing games (?). It's a wonder she never phoned up her buddy Susan Stine, the game player, who would have helped her a great deal.

[tylin]

I for one don't feel like we're wasting space.
Who knows what little tidbit of info could reveal something--something that's been overlooked for the past 10 years? Gawd knows weirder things than that have happened with this case.
Sue is right on.Steve specifically mentioned The New Collegiate Dictionary and that imo is important. As Sue said, that edition of that dictionary is of a certain size and that is important when dog-earred pages are referred to in the police report.

[sue]

Originally Posted by Moab

Good question Elle!!! LOL

I have the Webster's Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary (as I have said before)- published/copyright 1983

Incest is on page 609 (a right-hand page), and it is listed twice on the page

First it is listed in the top right margin where the first/last words on the page are listed (incest-incognitant)

Second it is the first word at the top of the left-hand column

No way to dog-ear a corner of a page, (either top or bottom) to point directly at that word...and that word only!

In my Webster's Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary published/copyright 1991, it is the same.