In-Depth Discussion of Kolar's Book "Foreign Faction: Who Really Kidnapped JonBenet?"

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by koldkase, Jul 20, 2012.

  1. Cherokee

    Cherokee FFJ Senior Member

    To extend the viewpoint of Bob's photo of the layout of the Ramsey house/backyard, here's another photo of that area that shows just how close the neighbor's fence was and smallness of the backyard.

    The photo was taken in April 2004 as I looked through the back gate at an angle. I was shocked to see how close the Ramsey house was to the neighbors and how tiny their backyard really was. The Ramsey house is even closer to the other neighbor, with both houses barely divided by a fence.

    I will add this photo to our Ramsey Case Library for reference.
     

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  2. Karen

    Karen Member

    A big thank you to those who are printing excerpts of the book for discussion! I have ordered the book but it won't arrive until August 3rd. This thread will tide me over until then. Thank you again!
     
  3. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    More seclusion

    Here's the grate. Note how narrow it is. I would love to know how anyone squeezed through it without leaving a mess of leaves and debris. Photo taken in 1999.
     

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    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 21, 2012
  4. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    Cherokee--I was there years before 2004 and I am certain that fence was not there. I know because some lady was raking leaves in the next yard and she was in plain view. We also noticed how sound carried so easily there--we heard the neighbor raking before we saw her.

    And there's that cat...
     
  5. Cherokee

    Cherokee FFJ Senior Member

    I was going to ask when you took your photos so we could date them. I wondered about the fence because it looked so new, and I'd never seen a pic that included it ... but then, photos were always cropped to show the front of the house. Of course, the iron grate fence in front was added later, so that's probably when they added the wood fence around the sides and back, as well as the back iron gate attached to the side of the house.

    My first thought upon seeing the house and yard, and then walking onto the property, was small it was and how close it was to the neighbors. In the press photos, the house always looked so imposing like a mansion on an estate, but it's nothing like that.

    We had a little corgi that followed us around and got in our photos. It was almost like a friendly presence that welcomed us.
     
  6. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    I am looking at my photos. That black metal fence did NOT exist--and I know the wooden one didn't either because I distinctly recall being surprised that anyone would focus on that window as an entry point because it was completely open. The North side of the house had a hedge row somewhat blocking the view of the next house, so if I wanted to enter the house illegally, I would have chosen that side over this one. This trip was in 1997 if I recall correctly. Possibly 98. I could figure it out.
     
  7. Cherokee

    Cherokee FFJ Senior Member

    I had the exact same thought when I saw the house! That north side of the house, as opposed to the south side where the open backyard was located, was much more hidden and secluded.
     
  8. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    Notice how small this house really is. I could touch the roof over the door with ease.
     

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  9. Elle

    Elle Member

    Thank you for posting these excellent photos, Bob. I can't imagine what this would be like actually standing right beside the Ramsey house. I take it no one was living there at the time (?).
     
  10. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    Elle--the house was so much smaller than it looked on TV. Yes it is a three story house but the ceilings were so low it reminded me of a doll house. Also--I don't know if it was because of the altitude or the hilly terrain in winter, but sound carried in a way I'd never really heard before. Looking in the windows was enlightening too--I could see how Burke could hear the refrigerator door open from the 2nd floor.

    There was no fence, no do not disturb signs or anything. I think it was for sale so we didn't feel bad about looking around. It was a very nice house--just smaller than I expected.

    The minute I saw it everything made sense.
     
  11. Elle

    Elle Member

    Could you elaborate further, Bob? Made Sense because ... ... ... ?
     
  12. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    Those pics are from 1999.

    Elle--when you find out about an extraordinary case like this through the media, you tend to view it like it's an episode of Murder She Wrote. All these crazy theories of terrorist teams and sexual sadists and child porn rings are part of that. But once I could see how small and quaint and ordinary this house was, I understood that something fairly mundane probably occurred that the family tried to cover up. Looking at the grate and broken window and the tons of debris in the window well--it finally struck me as to what great mental leaps you'd have to make in order for the intruder theory to work. I have always hated people who just dream up some half-baked theory and then try to shoe-horn all the facts into that.

    JBR's balcony was so low, I could touch it. There were pipes to climb up to that balcony and a grill you could stand on to get to it. That was the obvious way to get that little girl. All this convoluted crap about three or four people going through that stupid grate was obviously wishful thinking. And look at that video tape of the basement--do you see how low that window is? But John Ramsey said you'd need a suitcase to stand on to get out. Maybe if you were physically disabled or an elf--but otherwise no.
     
  13. Thor

    Thor Active Member

    Thanks for the pics BobC. I remember some of these from long ago that you posted. I plan on buying this book after payday, July 31.

    I think it is as simple as this as far as no arrest. The Rams had high profile attorneys on their side. They also had connections with the governor. Not to mention the crime scene being screwed up, Arndt's decision to let Lizard Tongue inspect the house around 1:00. Add in Alex Hunter being scared of the Rams' attorneys. Enter Hair Curtains to add the final touch. The Ramseys were well respected (not low life meth users, lower class, etc.). It's like the perfect storm.

    I gotta say, I still have my hackles raised about Burke's involvement. I have from the beginning and because Burke shall not STILL be talked about much, I still have suspicions. I'm not saying he did everything here, but it is hinky to me as far as his involvement in any of this. The only thing I'm certain of are these things. Patsy wrote that note. She and John were involved in the coverup (i.e. the fibers from Patsy's jacket, John's clothing, I think).

    SOMEONE was messing around with JonBenet with the sexual abuse. Before and near or at the time of her death. Who did what when?

    I still think all 3 of who were alive in that house that day know what happened. That's just my opinion and it is sad that it is where it is. Sad that the Rams thought they had to protect themselves with their money and power and not get justice from the "intruder". And after seeing that video on the Daily Beast, I hate Loose Mitts even more for his deception. Along with Hair Curtains.
     
  14. cynic

    cynic Member

    No, you’re right


    Boulder investigators did get one preliminary opportunity to speak with Burke, however, and Detective Fred Patterson had the foresight to scramble to the White residence not long after the discovery of JonBenét’s body. This interview took place at approximately 1500 hours on the afternoon of December 26, 1996, and a woman at the residence, identifying herself as Burke’s grandmother, sat in on the interview. The transcript of the recording was the first glimpse I had into Burke’s thought processes
    Foreign Faction, Who Really Kidnapped JonBenet?, James Kolar, page 346

    Although we were unaware of it at the time, the police had interrogated Burke quite extensively on the morning of December 26 while he had been at the Whites’. Police cannot legally question a child without a parent or guardian’s permission. They claimed in their written report that they had received permission from his grandmother to do the interview. (At the time his maternal grandmother, Nedra Paugh, was in Atlanta, and his paternal grandmother had died before Burke was born.) The police tape-recorded the session. However, we didn’t learn about this interrogation until Burke was subpoenaed to appear before the grand jury in 1999.
    Death of Innocence, John and Patsy Ramsey, page 31
     
  15. Karen

    Karen Member

    I don't believe a word John Ramsey says. I highly doubt Burke didn't tell his parents he talked to police at the Whites. I really highly doubt JR and PR didn't ask him what went on when he was at the Whites that day.

    Who was at the Whites house that day who was old enough to pass as Burkes grandma? And why didn't Burke tell the police it wasn't his grandma? Were Fleet and Priscilla already so suspicious of JR and PR that they asked an older female houseguest to claim to be Burkes grandma so there would be someone there to give permission for an interview....without JR and PR knowing about it?

    This whole story about Burkes interview at the Whites leaves a whole lot of questions.
     
  16. cynic

    cynic Member

    LOL, ITA.
    "we didn’t learn about this interrogation until Burke was subpoenaed to appear before the grand jury in 1999."
    Puh-leeze, try to make it at least a LITTLE believable.

    I certainly wouldn't mind hearing from the Whites on this one!
     
  17. Elle

    Elle Member

    Karen I believe the Whites and the Ramseys were no longer friends after this incident. I am surprised this interview did take place with Burke, with John Ramsey thinking his son Burke was in good hands.
     
  18. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    Karen I am with you. John Ramsey is liar and you can't trust a thing he says.
     
  19. Thor

    Thor Active Member

    I really wish we could hear from them on everything. I understand why they've been quiet, but good God it's been so long and I bet they've got a lot to tell.
     
  20. brenk

    brenk Member

    Oh, yes, I have the book. Only on page 151 as of now.
    Barbara Fernie's statment has changed my mind about maybe Doug
    had a sleep over with Burke.
    kk (kay)
     
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