McCann Case Still Unsolved?

Discussion in 'Madeleine McCann' started by koldkase, Feb 7, 2008.

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  1. Moab

    Moab Admin Staff Member

    I have deleted/edited a couple of posts about kites and their responses because it doesn't befit ANY of the FFJ membership to make those comments.

    I understand frustration, and I understand heat-of-the-moment, and I understand ALL of you are intelligent, wonderful, and passionate...especially about this case.

    :welcome: to the "new" Maddie thread!
    It will not contain snide remarks or personal attacks against other members.

    I have patched everyone up now with band aids, Ice packs (for those who forgot to duck), and a piece of raw meat on those black eyes (take it home and grill it for dinner after the eye starts feeling better).

    I am going to review the entire thread, and perhaps make even more edits, and then I will either add to this post, or make another one.

    I would suggest all take the evening off of this thread, and return tomorrow with a renewed vow to not beat up your siblings in this wonderful FFJ Family to which you are ALL coveted members.
     

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  2. Elle

    Elle Member

    Fer goodness sake, that's just a joke in Scotland Moab. I even put a smiley face on it.

    I felt badly about the remarks made to Nana from Brazil. What about those?

    P.S. Thank you for trying.
     
  3. Moab

    Moab Admin Staff Member

    Unkind remarks are just that...unkind... I didn't single anyone out, nor am I trying to point a finger at any one person... all of you are posting on this thread, so I was attempting to be all inclusive concerning getting along. :grouphug:

    Healthy discussion is great...heated discussion happens...this is a tough case...it crosses continents and customs. Things we don't do in the U.S. are done differently in other countries, but what we have to remember, not only are the customs different, the threats are different as well. We still have small towns in the U.S with little or no crime...yet we have an overall large crime rate in the U.S. in total.

    I think we can take the word of those members in other countries as to what publications are reputable and what ones aren't, and that gives us some added insight we normally wouldn't have known. The media over the last 10 years has really changed. Journalism used to be far more accurate. Today the media only cares about being first, not being right.

    Hope this helps.
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2008
  4. Moab

    Moab Admin Staff Member

    Hi Little,
    I'm sure Chero will pop in and answer this, but I wanted to give you my thoughts as well.
    Pro or Con, all articles are welcome with a link to the article as part of the discussion. As I mentioned in the previous post, sometimes we have to take the word of those nearby to let us know what publications are reputable. I might read something from one and take it as gospel, only to have another poster come on and tell me that the "source" was not known for giving accurate facts. That to me would be helpful when I was weighing how I felt about the information.

    Anything may be discussed as opinion. As with all cases, Transcripts, court documents and articles from reputable sources with links, are all welcome. No permissions necessary, pro and con welcome. I think there is not a lot of true factual information out there because so many cannot discuss the case...that makes it hard for us discussing it as well...we start getting into speculation and that isn't always a safe haven, we have only to look at the Ramsey case to remind us of that!

    I am right there with you Little...I hope and pray every day that this little innocent girl will be returned to her family, and I think perhaps it is one of the most bizarre cases I have followed.

    I hope this answers your questions, if not, please shoot me a PM.



    Carrion ya'll...

     
  5. Jayelles

    Jayelles Alert Viewer in Scotland

    Hold on a minute here.... Re "unkind" remarks were made to Nana from Brazil. The only "unkind" remarks that were made on this thread were directed towards me. I didn't complain about them, but the Mods evidently thought they were unkind since they were deleted. None of my posts to Nana have been deleted. There a distinction here between speaking the (unwelcome) truth and being unkind. I told Nana that what she posted was misleading and it was. Anyone who took the time to follow the link and read the entire article would see that for themselves.
     
  6. Jayelles

    Jayelles Alert Viewer in Scotland

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7422787.stm

    Reconstructions are usually made using actors. I can imagine what a media circus this would have turned into, but it seems odd that the Portuguese police didn't want it filmed. We have a programme here called "Crimewatch UK" and they have a terrific success rate in clearing up crimes due to people's memories being jogged by the reconstructions.
     
  7. rashomon

    rashomon Member

    The section taken from the link posted below is just an example of how complicated it is in the McCann case to sort through info and assess it.
    It lists the differing accounts allegedly given by Jane Tanner of the man she saw carrying a child she later believed to have been Maddie.
    I seems that at one time, Tanner was not sure that the man was carrying something; the locations where she saw him seem to vary too:

    http://www.mccannfiles.com/id30.html

    Also, if JT saw the lower part of pink pajama legs (as shown in the artist's drawing), hardly likely that it was Maddie because the pajama bottoms she wore were white also did not reach down to the ankles (see further down where there is a picture of the PJs).

    This site I took the link from contains a lot of info:

    http://www.mccannfiles.com/index.html

    But how to sort through all this? Imo we couldn't even open a 'just the facts' thread here yet because for every alleged 'fact', another 'fact' will show up contradicting the previous.

    Other examples:
    "The blood was Maddie's" vs "The blood was not from Maddie"
    "DNA tests incriminates the McCanns" vs "The DNA tests exonerates the McCanns"
    "Cadaver dogs are reliable and they did smell cadaver scent" vs. "The cadaver dog thing was a ruse by the police to trap the McCanns"

    The chaotic mass of contradictory info has only muddied the waters instead of clearing them.

    On many Madeleine forums, the discussion has strongly shifted to the McCanns themselves (pro- or anti) and away from time lines and such crucial things like weighing technical probability against non-probability.

    Maybe we could make a difference here on FFJ?

    I'd like to start with the time line.

    Imo what imo exonerates the McCanns is the narrow time frame in which they would have had to carry all this out. It is virtually impossible for them to have done it, given this time frame.
    If anyone thinks they could have done it in this time frame and how, I'd be interested in their theories.

    Also in their opinions re Murat and his possible involvement. Imo if he was involved, hardly likely that he acted alone. Maybe he spied out a good moment for the kidnappers to snatch Madeleine and got paid for it? Just my speculations though.

    jmo
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2008
  8. Jayelles

    Jayelles Alert Viewer in Scotland

    I agree that the timeline would tend to exonerate the McCanns. ALso, as I said before, how likely would they be to be able to join friends for a casual meal and actually behave normally?

    There is also the fact that they stayed in Portugal - Kate actually refused to leave until Madeleine was found. I think if they had anything to hide, they'd have gotten out of Dodge pdq.

    They didn't lawyer up until they were made arguidos - 4 months later.

    I honestly don't know anything about Robert Murat. I know he hung around the complex offering his help as a translator and I believe he actually translated for the McCanns or their friends in the early police interviews. He is bilingual - a tremendous asset. I think you'd be just so desperate for assistance and someone who speaks the lingo fluently would be a godsend.
     
  9. Moab

    Moab Admin Staff Member

    Exactly why I said this is such a complicated case Rash...it is hard to tell even where to begin to discern the true "facts" of the case, but I think the time line IS the place to start.
     
  10. Jayelles

    Jayelles Alert Viewer in Scotland

  11. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    I quit posting on this case or even reading about it, not only on this thread, but in general, because of the wild media reports and mutliple sideshows being manufactured. How can we know ANYTHING for fact in such a case? About all we can depend on is the timeline, and that, I agree, is proof positive that the McCanns had nothing to do with the child's disappearance.

    After the Ramsey case, I saw that Maddie's disappearance was more than likely going to end up the same: unsolved. The local LE is in a different country, on another continent, and the language, legal, and custom issues are insurmountable for me personally to get a real sense of what the heck is going on.

    I find it painful to see very dear members of FFJ hurt over this, but we are all passionate about such injustice, so it's going to happen, I guess. I hope our resident medic has patched up the wounds from the dust up. She's good that way! :cheerup:
     
  12. Jayelles

    Jayelles Alert Viewer in Scotland

    XXXSMOOCHXXX

    (Sorry about the bits of haggis in that...)
     
  13. Elle

    Elle Member

    Nicely said KK
     
  14. Jayelles

    Jayelles Alert Viewer in Scotland

    Go here:-

    http://www.findmadeleine.com/ns/news/detail/?id=37

    to read Kate and Gerry's presentation to the EU Parliament.

    It's an interesting read.

    ETA - From Gerry McCann's blog re the Petition:-

     
  15. RiverRat

    RiverRat FFJ Sr. Member Extraordinaire (Pictured at Lef

    Sweetheart......would you mind checking in that bag to see if my patience is in there because I am starting to think that I have lost it.
     
  16. Moab

    Moab Admin Staff Member

    :mears: ...It is in the top dresser drawer under your skivies!
    xoxo
    :aprop:
     
  17. RiverRat

    RiverRat FFJ Sr. Member Extraordinaire (Pictured at Lef

    Perfect......all the good stuff is right under my panties.
     
  18. Moab

    Moab Admin Staff Member

    :floor: :floor: :floor: :floor: :floor:
     
  19. Little

    Little Member

    read entire article here: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article4022991.ece
     
  20. Little

    Little Member

    Read entire article here: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article4023033.ece
     
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