The Purpose Of the Ransom Note

Wasn't the intruder-roaming-around theory a late concoction? I don't remember Patsy and John putting this forward on Dec. 26.

The main reasons I don't think John was involved before the morning are 1. he doesn't have to be; 2. if both were involved on Dec. 25, they both would have been to bed (ostensibly) and both would be freshly showered on the morning of Dec. 26., not just John. There wasn't any reason they had to make the 911 call at 5:42 am. They could have waited long enough for Patsy to take a shower and put on different clothes. The fact that Patsy rather obviously hadn't been to bed was a serious flaw in her alibi.

 

All I remember reading about the Ramseys' "early" theory was that John said it was in inside job. What I addressed was what they might have been thinking when setting up all the clues meant to be found by LE. If they came out of the gate and said to LE that morning, "Oh, it's an intruder and he was wandering around for hours while we were gone--let me lead you to all the clues and explain..." obvously they would have tipped their hand immediately.

It's all a lot of speculation, at any rate, and we're all just speculating, as far as what they would have done, thought, etc. So your speculation is as good as anyone's, but we still have no proof of what they thought, didn't think, would have done, wouldn't have done, etc. I have satisfied myself, that's all.

I personally see no proof that Patsy "hadn't been to bed" any more than that John hadn't. Either or both could have been up all night. John showering and Patsy not showering...we really don't know but what they told us, which means we really don't know.

I don't get what you mean when you say John didn't "need" to be in on it before the next morning. So if he's involved, he went on to bed while Patsy staged the crime scene? And what do you mean, "they both would have been to bed (ostensibly)"? Or are you saying you believe John was asleep and had nothing to do with anything until he got up the next morning, showered, and Patsy came screaming to him and he decided to play along at some point to save his wife/son? Sorry I'm not following, just confused.

Or are you arguing that John wasn't involved in the murder or cover up? So John goes to bed, while Patsy...what? She surely didn't get in bed fully dressed and John didn't notice, by some wild chance. So she kept her clothes on and said, "Oh, I'm going to sleep with my clothes on so I don't have to bother dressing in the morning." Or maybe she told John she was going to pack some more blah blah? So John went to bed alone...and then lied about that for Patsy?

Obviously, I've missed your point here. Sorry, too much sugar and a busy Halloween. :blush:

 

The fact that Patsy was in full makeup and wearing the same clothes as the night before led police to conclude that she'd never been to bed. John, on the other hand, was wearing different clothes from the previous night. (Let's just forget about the showering part.) Patsy's flub here immediately aroused police suspicions. So if both were in on the staging that night, why was one alibi neatly packaged up while the other alibi was so obviously messed up? Why didn't they both go upstairs and change clothes? Why didn't John tell Patsy to remove her makeup if she was too much of a dingbat to figure it out herself?

The murder and staging only required one person to accomplish. Since Patsy wrote the note, that person is Patsy. That's what I mean by John not having to be involved.

The other factor in my thinking is John's demeanor. According to Arndt, he was calm and cracking a joke or two in the morning. Then he disappeared around 10 and when he came back around 11am, he was nervous, worried and preoccupied. So while Patsy was wailing, weeping and fake throwing-up in the other room, John was swanning around relatively unconcerned and calm until something happened. What happened is what he told John Andrew--that he found the body at 11am.

So, yeah, I've come to the conclusion that John was not involved until the morning, that he wasn't even sure what had happened until he found the body at 11am. If I'm not mistaken, this is also what the police think.

 

"....Retire we to our chamber.
A little water clears us of this deed:
How easy is it then! Your constancy
Hath left you unattended.--[Knocking within.] Hark, more
knocking:
Get on your nightgown, lest occasion call us
And show us to be watchers:--be not lost
So poorly in your thoughts."

Even Mr. and Mrs. MacBeth knew how to construct an alibi.

(I read somewhere, koldkase, that you were a drama teacher.)

 

Yes, I too, have often thought John Ramsey wasn't involved until he found JonBenét's body the morning of the 26 December, and he behaved in a strange manner, including keeping his distance from Patsy. I also remember reading he told John Andrew he had found JonBenét's body at 11:00 am.

 

It's this simple to me: Do you think Patsy went to bed wearing those clothes and John didn't notice? Then she got back up and went to murdering JB?

I can't imagine Patsy on a murderous rampage and cover up all night while wearing all the clothes she wore to the White's party and the next morning when LE arrived. I personally don't find it unusual that she would put on the same clothes two days in a row, especially since none of the same people other than John and JB and Burke would notice as she'd be gone from Boulder. I've done as much, IOW.

So laying that "grooming" issue aside, I can't believe she didn't take off her jacket, her stockings, her shoes, her wig, etc., all night. (She had wigs and wore them even as a young woman, remember, as well as during cancer treatments.) Who comes in after a long day, heading to bed or at least to comfort, and doesn't take off her clothes PDQ? I'm not convinced that Patsy's clothes and makeup are proof positive she alone was up all night while John got his beauty sleep. Maybe she was, but it's just speculation. They alone know, IMO. Maybe John's clothes got dirtier than hers, so he changed, for example. Maybe he got that mold from the basement room on his pants knees, or something like that? Maybe Patsy did, too, and they both just changed pants, only Patsy put on the same color or even had two pairs of the same brand--very common when you have a staple like that in your wardrobe.

Again, it's still speculation. Just because it could be done by one person doesn't mean it was. And John's Isreali wool shirt fibers were found in the genital area of JB. Of course that doesn't mean he was there, but he could have been. Look at it the same way you're concluding it was all Patsy: she wrote the note, so she did it alone; his shirt fibers were there, so he was there. Either assumption could be right or wrong. It takes other evidence to determine which is more or less likely.

And here's other evidence that John was involved, IMO. Just why would you be "cordial" and "calm and cracking a joke or two" if you awoke to your child missing at the hands of some unknown criminal(s) who not only got into your home and took her under your nose while you slept, but threatened to cut her head off, for god's sake? I think John already knew what had happened and wasn't worried for JonBenet's or his family's safety. He was worried if they were going to prison. That's why he was playing it cool, so he wouldn't lose his cool and make a mistake, and to keep Patsy on track, as well. Of course, that's just speculation, too.

Also, why would John not tell LE about that "open" basement window pronto? Why would he not search the house top to bottom, waking Burke to find out if he knew something, before even calling LE? Why was he so sure the SFF wasn't in the house when they "found" the note, immediately going into "fight or flight" mode to protect his family and possibly JonBenet, who might still be there, too? He didn't even think to get a gun, which he had? Instead, he gets on his hands and knees to read the note after leaving Burke upstairs unprotected, with kidnappers on the loose and two sets of stairs up and down and rooms everywhere to hide in? Nobody who has ever had their home burgled would say they didn't consider their immediate safety first. Didn't even cross either Ramseys' minds. I don't buy it.

I don't know what the police think. Did I miss something? I know Thomas always gave John a pass, but that's a long time ago. As far as I can see, John has no alibi, either. All three people in the home claimed to have been asleep. They can't alibi each other.

I'll add one more thing, and it's pure speculation, let me say up front: the garrote with its "handle" has always seemed like something a male would make. I haven't seen anywhere in Patsy's life that she would have been studying things like garrotes or strangulation devices. Making it up on the spot? Possible. But John was in the Navy and Burke was in Boy Scouts and the guys in this family seem much more likely, as "sailors," to be aware of such things than a woman whose life was beauty pageants and fashion and decorating, and who probably had manicured faux nails and couldn't catch a softball decently. Patsy was focused on raising children to be the winners she meant them to be, not how to kill the enemy at war or some such macho thing.

Having said that, Patsy was obsessive about wearing scarves and putting dog collars on JB's costumes, etc. Coincidence? Maybe. Or maybe she did have something in her past that caused her to repeat that "fashion" theme for her entire life, even after JB died by garrote. Maybe she did know how to make a garrote from some hideously warped past experience we know nothing about.

I actually believe LE does know some of these answers. I don't. So this is just my opinion, as ever, and means absolutely nada in the big scheme.

 

Along with the rest of your excellent post KK (which I agree with), this in particular makes me say Bingo!!!

(And here's other evidence that John was involved, IMO. Just why would you be "cordial" and "calm and cracking a joke or two" if you awoke to your child missing at the hands of some unknown criminal(s) who not only got into your home and took her under your nose while you slept, but threatened to cut her head off, for god's sake? I think John already knew what had happened and wasn't worried for JonBenet's or his family's safety. He was worried if they were going to prison. That's why he was playing it cool, so he wouldn't lose his cool and make a mistake, and to keep Patsy on track, as well. Of course, that's just speculation, too.)

 

JUst a thought in passing

The very dramatic scene of Patsy in the sun room with her friends all around her and her being the drama queen and all is the setting. We all remember it. The one thing that I find hard not to dismiss is the telling of her looking around that room at various times "THROUGH SPLAYED FINGERS." Remember that one? Well lets suppose that this could be around the 10 AM hour that morning and for some reason Patsy knew that John was "missing" from her view as well as the mob of friends. Then when he came back into view about an hour later she does her splayed fingers looking to see if he had the body of JonBenet. It's just something that came to me. With that scene and that take on it it could mean that Patsy was the doer and John didn't know anything until then.

Just supposin'.

 

Oh yes, Lady MacBeth told her Lord to screw his courage to the sticking point. She made the plans. But he knew what he was doing when he did it, just the same.

Too bad Patsy wasn't as weak as Lady MacBeth. No hand-wringing for Patsy. She wasn't a bit worried about that damn spot.

 

I actually went back and added another paragraph of things that John did that morning which indicate to me he was in on it all along. I've spent way too much time on this case. :yes:

Anyway, so you don't have to go read it all again:

 

I don't think that Patsy ever did go to bed that night. I think she stayed up to finish her packing. Before she'd finished, she had a fatal encounter with JonBenet who had wet her bed. The rest of Patsy's night and early morning was taken up with staging. Then she was too busy to take off her clothes or remove her makeup.

I do think that John would have noticed that she hadn't gone to bed. He knew she wasn't in bed when he got up and she was wearing the same clothes as the evening before. She was fully made up. But she was also screaming about JonBenet being missing. These two things wouldn't jive. If John didn't really buy the kidnapping story, it would explain his relative unconcern. I think he spent the morning buying time, trying to figure out what had happened. But if he knew JonBenet was dead all along, he would know that he should squeeze out some tears. He's not a moron.

If two people are conspiring together, they're going to think about how it's going to look to the police. It would be important that both people look like they got up from a sound sleep. It would be important that both people appear to be distraught. Patsy and John would understand this.

I'm taking Steve Thomas' position as representative of the police position. For what it's worth, I started out thinking that John was probably involved in the murder and staging, but because I was aware (perhaps mistakenly) that the police didn't think so, I asked myself why.

 

Yes, and Lady MacBeth said that they needed to retire to their bed chamber and that MacBeth needed to put on his nightgown. (I think she was already wearing hers.) Why? So they would look like they'd both been in bed all night and not up murdering what's his name.

 

I've started thinking about whether Patsy might have been more mentally ill than we have supposed. This might have been something that was only known to John, Burke and JonBenet.

My mother was schizophrenic and to this day her sister doesn't know this. If I told her, she'd tell me I'm crazy. During her many hallucinatory rampages my mother talked to imaginary people--when we were lucky. When we were unlucky, she'd rant at us and her preoccupations were of a sexual and/or violent nature. Even the dog was a sinner because he didn't wear pants, you see, so he was flaunting his junk in her face. Nobody outside of the people in our house knew anything about it. (Well, maybe the neighbors on one side were aware.) My mother was able to hold it together, more or less, in the outside world. And it was a big, big secret.

Is there any indication that Patsy was schizophrenic? Not much that I know of, but there is a strong co-occurrence of panic attacks and schizophrenia.

So it occurs to me that John might have been familiar with some fairly bizarre behavior on Patsy's part. He may have known immediately that she wrote the note without realizing the implications.

 

Oh, Fr brown, I am so sorry you went through this. It must have been terrifying.

This is what I don't understand about IDIs who think that no way the Ramseys could have done this or that; especially when they talk about them as if they lived with them or in their heads. NOBODY knows what goes on behind closed doors except the people who are behind them.

I was thinking the other day about John's LE interview in '98, when he was talking about Patsy's cancer and surgery and how that had affected their sex life--it obviously changed; he said it was difficult for her after that. She went through immediate hormonal changes, of course. He mentioned taking a fan to her hospital room because of her hot flashes after the surgery when they removed her reproductive organs, that kind of thing. I could really get a sense of how hard it had been on them all.

Then when Patsy talked in her interview that June as well, about being so sick and taking her temp every 15 min's. or so, it sounded simply unbearable. I thought, she really went through hell.

And I wondered how that had affected her coming out the other side.

Her family and friends all painted her like a saint every time they spoke. Even those who became disparaging never said anything about her behavior or moods being extreme in an unpredictable way. I find it very hard to believe them; she said in her own book she was terrified and had moods and depression. Who wouldn't, particularly after what she went through?

So if she had mental problems, as your mother did, her family kept them hidden. Who knows, maybe she kept them from her family herself. In either case, her cracking that night would be more plausible.

There are so many sexual components in this case that were not natural, in that family's history--yeah, THERE it is, coming from John himself regarding his and Patsy's lack of intimacy during her cancer treatments and recovery. IOW, it was unavoidable, but it was not business as usual between spouses. Then there were JonBenet's vaginal injuries from some previous events; sadly, they may not be uncommon, considering the stats that one out of three females are sexually abused as children, but they're still not acceptable as "normal."

It just gives me the creeps thinking about who was molesting JonBenet. I can't imagine this wasn't a serious part of what led to her death. So for what it's worth--not much--I believe this is all connected. If Patsy found herself in some mental state which led to the death of JonBenet, I think the sexual abuse was an intense motivation or catalyst. When I read Pam Archuleta's words that Patsy told her she was worried about JonBenet flirting too much and being too friendly, I knew then that Patsy knew very well JonBenet was being molested, and she put at least some of the blame on JonBenet. Well, that's my opinion.

 

It was a lot of things.

I don't want to go too far down the road of rank speculation, but I'll just note that Melissa Huckaby, the Sunday school teacher, who molested and killed a young girl was schizophrenic and a Xanax addict.

It's not impossible that Patsy had something like that going on. Thomas thought that Patsy was responsible for JonBenet's chronic vaginal injuries.

Patsy seems to have been better adjusted than my mother, but then my mother never took Xanax.

 

So sorry to read this about your mother fb. ThIs had to be a very difficult time for you and your family.

Patsy Ramsey being schizophrenic would fit this crime perfectly. I do remember looking at some paintings Patsy Ramsey painted, and I found most of them very depressing. Who knows, maybe the drugs she was taking for her cancer caused depression (?).

 

I, too, am sorry you had to deal with this growing up. You're last line ("... it was a big, big secret") rings true for a lot of people and many on this forum. One of the things that really upsets me about the Ramsey case is the IDIs always try to paint the Ramseys as perfect and saintly, and that there could not possibly be any hint of mental illness, drug dependency or other stressors in the family. Even IF I believed the Ramseys were innocent, I could never believe in the white-washed, sinless Ramseys as projected by their supporters. Anyone, with even a small amount of psychological insight, can see the Ramsey family was dysfunctional at best and hid some very bad secrets at worst.

Some of the long-time posters of this forum will remember me talking about a family member who was much like your mother. Her psychological diagnosis may have been different, but the horrible rants (and beatings) directed to her children were the same in that no one outside the family knew of them. To everyone else, this person could be sweet as pie, and she was known for her hard work and faithful church attendance. The explosions of anger always occured at home, behind closed doors where no one could see the demon. It became worse when the father went off to war, and there was no one to come home from work and protect the children.

People who have not lived in this type of family do not understand how there can be such a divided reality: the one that is public, and the one that is private. The outsiders think they would surely catch a glimpse of such anger and terrible behavior, but the perpetrator (and the family) are very careful to make sure that never happens.

I know of another person who used to pray for the phone to ring when her mother was in one of her lashing tirades. If it did, the mother's tone of voice immediately changed from one of screaming anger to a very gracious, "hello," and the ensuing phone call created a break in the trauma whereby the child might be able to escape outside. The person at the other end of the line NEVER KNEW what had been happening just before their call was answered, and would not have believed it if you told them. Just as with Patsy, the mother could not have her friends and neighbors see her when she was out of control.

Patsy had a lot of stressors, the first of which was trying to keep up the illusion of perfection in herself and in her life. When cancer came, it spoiled the perfection until Patsy became convinced that God had selected her for a special miracle (as opposed to all the others He just let die of cancer). Patsy's surgeries and chemo caused great upset in her physical, emotional and mental equilibrium, and for her, an intake of anti-depressants and tranquilizers became necessary. There were other stressors as well.

Xanax is a tranquilizer that is frequently given to people who experience panic attacks, such as the ones Patsy relates. Xanax can be a temporary relief from the terrors of these attacks if used within the context of psychological therapy and in conjunction with carefully controlled dosages of anti-depressants. Unfortunately, Xanax is not always used in this way, and because it is a benzodiazepene, it can become very addictive if used longer than a period of a few weeks. At that point, if a person is not weaned from the use of Xanax, they will start having periods of anxiousness and panic attacks that can only be calmed by either increased dosage or more frequent use of Xanax. This anxiousness can be expressed in the form of extreme anger, or rage, as the chemical receptors in the brain cry out for more Xanax. It is considered dangerous to combine alcohol with Xanax, or with any other neuro-depressive medicine for many reasons.

All was not well at the Ramsey household on Christmas Day 1996. There were things going on in private that could not be told. There were family pressures, and relationships, and illness, and all the other stuff that can make life messy at times. Underneath it all was a thread; an unhealthy preoccupation with perfection and making a very young child the epitome of mature sexual beauty. JonBenet was Patsy's alter ego; Patsy as Miss America, Patsy as perfect.

Something in all that perfection, in that perfect family, cracked, and JonBenet's death was the result. And whatever it was ... it became "a big, big secret" when the Ramseys decided to cover-up what really happened behind closed doors.

 

This certainly is a very believable account of what took place in Patsy Ramsey's life, Cherokee. I can agree with all you have stated above, and I do believe the drug Xanax could have taken its toll on Patsy Ramsey on Christmas night 26th December, 1996, ending in JonBenét's death.

Yes! This is defnitely a very believable account.

 

We all have a little Jekyl and Hyde in us. This is what makes you sick when the IDI just can't believe the saintly Ramsey family could never be involved in something like this.

With everything that had happened to Patsy (cancer, treatment, depression, drugs for depression), I've been wondering more lately about the following scenario. Let's say JR, BR or JAR had been the source of JBR's vag. injury. Let's say Patsy found out her daughter had been violated. In her mental state, would that have pushed her over the boundary; could it have caused her to sacrifice her daughter because her daughter was no longer pure, no longer the perfect little girl who was destined for Miss America? And would this be the reason that JR could not finger his wife? If you can believe PMPT, I always thought it very telling about the reported conversation Shapiro had with JR on the phone. In this supposed conversation, Shapiro tells John he thinks he's innocent but he suspects his wife. Supposedly, JR remained quiet and didn't speak.

 

I think Patsy Ramsey would have been pushed over the boundary long before Christmas of 1996 arrived, Learnin, if this had been the reason. Patsy was also a very organized type of person, I feel she would have sacrificed JonBenét at another time, not when she had to prepare to fly to Charlevoix. This was not a good time for something like this to take place.

I can very easily understand why you could arrive at a plan like this with all Patsy had been through with her illness.

I can't recall this supposed conversation you mention above between Shapiro and John Ramsey. I will need to check it out. Thank you for bringing it up.