But he was such a wonderful man...

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by Watching You, Jan 16, 2007.

  1. Watching You

    Watching You Superior Bee Admin

    For the past ten years we have been swamped by the swampsters with the ridiculous theory that the Ramseys couldn't have killed their daughter because they were such wonderful people, not to mention active in their church and their children's school.

    For the past 20+ years, neighbors in a nice, quiet Cheektowaga, NY, neighborhood thought the world of Alternio Sanchez, a man who was married with two grown sons, a man who was active in his church and who coached little league baseball. Here was a man who pulled people out of snowbanks during the last October snowstorm that paralyzed the Buffalo area. He was kind to everyone. Well, almost everyone.

    I watched the news last night and saw neighbors in stunned disbelief. One older man was in tears as he described this wonderful, kind man he had called his neighbor for many years. One woman who lived across the street from this man and his family couldn't believe he was the monster who police called the "Bike Path Rapist," a brutal man who had raped and murdered several women over a long period of time, a monster who kept his secrets buried for a decade after his initial burst of rapes and murder but who made the mistake of letting his demons out after a 10 year hiatus and brutally murdered a woman on a bike path in Amherst, NY, in September of last year.

    His neighbors didn't know. His sons didn't know. Even his wife didn't know she was married to a monster. He even looks like the many composites done over the years of the rapist, but he was such a nice guy, nobody connected his face to those composites.

    The swampsters are dead wrong in their thinking that what's presented to the public is all there is to sexual predators and murderers. There have been several "wonderful" people who turned out to be murderers and sexual offenders. The swampsters need to take off their rose-colored glasses and see the Ramseys as they really were - flawed human beings who committed the unthinkable on an unholy night.

  2. Watching You

    Watching You Superior Bee Admin

    The police caught the Bike Path Rapist through good, solid police work. They followed him for the past couple of weeks and finally got lucky when he and his wife went to dinner at a restaurant. They told the restaurant's staff not to touch any of the dishes/glasses/silverware used by this man. Within 24 hours, they had a 100 percent match to the DNA left by the BPR.

    mame and her cronies should take notice as to how DNA really works. The police got good DNA from a drinking glass used by this guy. Just think of how much more good DNA would be available from flesh gouged out of someone's skin and lodged under fingernails. mame just doesn't get it, and she never will.
  3. RiverRat

    RiverRat FFJ Sr. Member Extraordinaire (Pictured at Lef

    Another freak off of the streets! I mean, nice guy.....

    Should we go ahead and send him jameson's info so that she can start his support site, I mean, discussion site? Since everyone else has Started Over without hir and Patsy's dead, what else is there?
  4. heymom

    heymom Member

    Yep, the same with the BTK killer. A Scout leader, an elder in his church, all kinds of community service, and upwards of 30 people murdered. I cannot imagine the horror and shame his wife and 2 sons must have experienced as they learned that the person they had loved and trusted was the monster who had killed and mutilated so many innocent people.

    Appearances indeed can be deceiving.
  5. Barbara

    Barbara FFJ Senior Member

    These stories remind me of the other church going "accountant" who murdered his entire family, began a new life (he "got on with his life" too) as an accountant with a new identity and was found almost 30 years later; again a shock to his new family, neighbors and friends

    These two more stories of good, church going people need to be rammed down the throats of the RST, right next to the "no history" chant they still spew.

    The public should get the hint: Christians, Jews, whatever; if they are patting themselves on the back about what good, God fearing people they are: LOOK AT THEM FIRST!!!!!

    It's sickening!
  6. Paradox

    Paradox Banned for Stupidity by RiverRat

    There is a misbegotten sense of what "Good" is. Goodness is not aping socially accepted behavioral ideals.

    good 1. moral excellence, virtue.

    virtue 1. moral excellence, goodness. 2. conformity of one's life and conduct to moral and ethical principles. L virtut- (s. of virtus) maleness, equiv. to vir, man (see virile).

    There you have it; the Good Man conforms to moral principles. Of course, we have the problem of APPEARANCES. We can appear to be good with our social persona and yet have a private, dark side: as Ted Haggard showed.

    In some of the old Latin and Greek texts, virtue is synonomous with cleverness; mentaly bright, quick intelligence, able, adroit.

    To me, Goodness is the exercise of consciousness; the establishment of a strong ego, participation with the four functions of consciousness (thinking, feeling, sensation, intuition), and mediation of instinct and impulse, all with regard to a higher power (The Self) that resides both inside and outside of us.

    Evil is the unwillingness to mediate one's instinct and impulses in favor of self gratification to the point of being detrimental to things and creatures around one. Classically, Evil appears Good.
  7. Paradox

    Paradox Banned for Stupidity by RiverRat

    In a Jungian sense, the Battle of Good vs Evil and the Quest for Victory is about humankind's dilemma of consciousness; the rise of the ego out of the infantile fusion with the unconscious and the participation with response and decison making.

    This is what hooked me on the Ramsey case. The ransom note mentions salvation and victory corresponding to a death that was not clearly an accident. Here was something that showed someone was aware of the conscious dilemma but succumbed to Evil.
  8. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    I have always found those who whine about how wonderful and incapable of such violence the Ramseys are a true indication of emotional immaturity. People making those claims often have never even met the Ramseys. Or they've met them briefly, under limited circumstances.

    Do they REALLY believe that the Ramseys are going to blurt out, You know, we're actually perverts who murdered JonBenet, but other than that--PERFECT!

    How silly to imagine for ONE MINUTE anyone but the Ramseys knew what went on in THAT FAMILY when the doors closed. As this NY case illustrates, Watching You, as well as countless others, no one knows what is in another's heart. NO ONE.

    One thing of which we have proof positive, in black and white, and on tape, is that the Patsy Ramsey lied repeatedly and over many years to LE. As Kane once said, she was not forthcoming and open with them. She was evasive, combative, and she changed her story many, many times. She remembered what she needed to remember, to "explain" evidence when it suited her agenda, but the simplest things, like her routine grooming and care of JonBenet...NOT A CLUE.... La di da.

    What more does a person have to know when a child has been murdered than her parents obstructed the investigation from the minute her body was found, continuing for 10 years? But add in the ACTUAL EVIDENCE, minus the propaganda and spin, and you don't have to be a brain surgeon to see who is hiding behind lawyers...and why.
  9. Kangatruth

    Kangatruth Member

    some people..and I dont put mame . jam and cohorts into this category as they are simply irational, deluded and probably mentally impaired, but most other people often baulk at the concept of a "good" person committing evil for a rathr bizzarre reason.... themselves !! that is to say, to allow these other 'good' people to be able to commit henious crimes is to say that they themselves might be capable, and some are.
    we ar enot perfect, we al lhave our foibles. For many these are minimal and transient. For some they manifest ino irational behaviour, often camouflaged from those close to them because they themselves dont want to confront the monster in the mirror. Some people do live a Jeckyl and Hyde existance, som even know it. Some dont.

    But as said....for some to concede that tha nice man r woman down the block could be a monster might cause an internal confrontation that some just dont want to invite.
  10. heymom

    heymom Member

    Spot on, Kanga! It IS frightening to think that anyone you know, really, could be a mass murderer, although I do think that people like this give off clues and aren't as normal as they seemed to be. We all contain the possibility of evil being expressed, and the Ramseys are no exception to this. Under severe stress, we just don't know how we ourselves might snap and commit a violent act. We remain in control under the circumstances of our normal lives, and we pray for self-control in difficult circumstances, but how fragile our mental state can be...how terrifyingly evil we can be in the wrong conditions...

    Another recent example is the man who murdered the Amish girls - supposedly to avenge something he himself had done while young. Yet investigators couldn't find any evidence that any molestation had ever taken place. What was his mental state, and how did he hide it from his family, or convince them that he was OK?
  11. Elle

    Elle Member

    Thank you for your excellent account of this rapist, WY. I have been following the news on this for some time, because Buffalo is just across the river from us, as you know. Quite frightening for our small town, because we did have another rapist from Buffalo 21 years ago, who came over here and raped one of my neighbours at 2:30 am. Her husband was the retired plumber who had installed my washer and dryer, so they were both Seniors.

    This neighbour's back garden faced my front window, and I did notice the drapes drawn that morning, not knowing her husband was lying with an injury to his head, and she was upstairs badly beaten. I did visit her in the hospital. It was very sad. Both of them are now deceased, but I was extra cautious when checking my windows and doors while the news of this Bike Path Rapist was on the news.

    So please be careful girls before you head for bed at night. Check those windows and doors. If you have to have the window open, make sure you have a solid steel bar to prevent the window from being opened further.
    If you have a patio door open while in the rec room, please lock it when you leave; even if it's just for a few minutes, because a few minutes is all it takes for someone to enter.

    I have a husband who likes the window opened, even in the winter, and he never thinks to put a protecting bar on the inside ledge, to prevent it being opened further. Not a good caretaker. Do the checking yourselves girls.

    I forgot to add, this rapist came over on a bike.
  12. Paradox

    Paradox Banned for Stupidity by RiverRat

    There are no doors or windows to close to keep Mommy out.
  13. Show Me

    Show Me FFJ Senior Member

    Ann Rule thought Ted Bundy was a 'nice' guy.

    Ask Merrick how nice John is, and all the other bus victims.

    Ask some of John's former employees.

    Ask the Boulder LE who tried to get the Ramseys to cooperate in their daughter's murder.

    I don't consider John a nice man at all.
  14. Barbara

    Barbara FFJ Senior Member

    By many accounts, John wasn't considered a nice man even before the murder.

    There didn't seem to be any argument that he was cranky about the vacuum cleaner, the dog, the kids, and just about everything else that interfered with his "quietude"
  15. Little

    Little Member

    Admittedly it's 2nd hand information, but my "source" (hey! I have a source, imagine that!!) told me that John liked to hang around the water cooler a bit too much, and that no, he was not well-liked or respected by many of his empolyees. In fact, he was not considered either nice or honest.

  16. Amber

    Amber Member

    I'm reading a book at the moment;Harold Shipman. Prescription for Murder

    The blurb on the back reads:

    Dr. Harold Shipman was a pillar of the community, serving on local committees, donating prizes to the rugby club, organising charity collections. His patients thought the world of him: he was attentive, kind, never too busy to chat. And he was Britain's most prolific serial killer, with over 250 victims, all of whom were his own patients.

    There are reports that he murdered over 500, but the evidence was weaker in thoses other cases.

  17. tylin

    tylin Banned

    He's such a nice man...isn't that what some said about Michael Jackson? :argue:

    You know what galls me? Some people have no problem saying John and Patsy couldn't have done this yet ignore statistics about children murdered in their own home. Sadly and simply put, children murdered in their own home are generally murdered by someone in their family.
  18. Jayelles

    Jayelles Alert Viewer in Scotland

    I've read that book - it was unbelievable. That wife....
  19. heymom

    heymom Member

    That is one reason I believe that John may have been more culpable in "that child's" death than anyone suspects. If the kids were wound up, making noise, throwing conniption fits, as children who are up too late are wont to do, something could have send John over his threshhold.
  20. Paradox

    Paradox Banned for Stupidity by RiverRat

    In answer to a question; the conscious dilemma occurs because the infantile ego must rise out of the unconscious and begin to face the realities of nature and society. When the infantile ego is still in the unconscious it experiences itself as central and all powerful, very much in the vein of a God. As we grow and gain experience we run into the larger powers of nature and society that don't behave as we little Gods would like them to. We have to adapt. This amounts to a self sacrifice of the illusion of godhood and a humbling to the larger powers. Thrown into the mix is our propensity to project unconscious content onto the larger powers. We may then become trapped between the actual infantile unconsciousness and the projected illusion of identity with Godhood. It takes a moral effort i.e. "Goodness" to make one's way throught the dilemma. Evil is the abandoning of the effort and actively trying to manifest one's illusion in nature and society.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice