I think she was wearing the pink nightgown when she died

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by madeleine_ws, Jan 5, 2010.

  1. madeleine_ws

    madeleine_ws Member

    These are some snippets that kinda confuse me:

    JOHN RAMSEY: It wouldn't be, no,
    6 it would be unusual for her to have those on.
    7 Leggings, kind of just a regular nightgown. She
    8 didn't always wear a nightgown to bed. If she
    9 was awake when she went to bed, she got into a
    10 nightgown
    and brushed her teeth, got into bed.
    11 But if she was asleep, we usually just tried to
    12 make her comfortable, make sure she was warm.
    13 Didn't go into the trouble of getting her into a
    14 nightgown, necessarily. Sometimes she had a tee
    15 shirt on.

    JOHN RAMSEY: I laid her on the
    21 bed. I didn't -- I don't remember the cover,
    22 if the bed was made or not, but I laid her on
    23 the bed. Because I knew Patsy would follow up
    24 to put her nightgown on
    and get her ready for
    25 bed.

    LOU SMIT: We have heard
    16 that a Barbie nightgown was one of her
    17 favorite nightgowns. What can you tell us
    18 about that?
    19 JOHN RAMSEY: I think she had a
    20 Barbie nightgown, yeah, as I recall. Pink,
    21 maybe.
    22 LOU SMIT: The night you put
    23 her in bed, do you remember anything about
    24 a Barbie nightgown?
    25 JOHN RAMSEY: When I put
    1 her to bed she had on, when I laid her
    2 down in the bed, she had on what she had
    3 worn to the Whites. She had that same
    4 shirt on when I found her.

    TOM HANEY: We've heard at some point this
    2 was a particularly favorite nightgown. Did she have
    3 such a thing?
    4 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, her favorite little
    5 pajamas were like -- was this one piece sort of Jeannie
    6 thing my mother had given her, kind of nylon; a little
    7 one piece thing. You stepped into it and put your arms
    8 out. Other than that, nothing special.
    9 TRIP DEMUTH: But would your sister, Pam,
    10 call this her travel nightgown for any reason? I could
    11 be wrong.
    12 PATSY RAMSEY: I mean, like pageants did we
    13 take one?
    14 TRIP DEMUTH: Is there a reason she would say
    15 that?
    16 PATSY RAMSEY: I just don't remember making a
    17 big deal about taking one special nightgown to the
    18 pageants. I think more likely we took the little
    19 Jeannie pant thing because it would be -- if she had
    20 her hair in curlers, you could step into it instead of
    21 pulling it over your head. I don't know.

    JOHN RAMSEY: I had never seen
    11 that. I didn't see it when he was down this.
    12 Sounds very bizarre. I don't know why that
    13 would be there. I mean that room was usually
    14 full of Christmas stuff. It's a nasty room.
    15 Just you didn't go in there.

    First of all,it seems JR knows more about JB's favourite clothes than PR.Weird.

    We know she was redressed (why does JR reassure us that "when I laid her
    2 down in the bed, she had on what she had
    3 worn to the Whites. She had that same
    4 shirt on when I found her."?)
    and maybe this is the reason the gown was found next to her.They redressed her in the basement where all the rest of the cover-up took place,maybe they didn't want to wake up Burke.

    Everything they say about putting her to bed is...........it's just.....something's not right....I think they are lying about the gown and it has to do with the fact that she was AWAKE when they arrived home.

    Sounds unbelievable that JR instantly saw the white blanket but never saw the PINK nightgown.It's not like he was down there 1 second,he had time to take the tape off,the ligature...

    Why are they avoiding the questions about this gown being her FAVOURITE?

    Wearing the gown when it happened could explain the big undies.Wearing those under some pants would be very uncomfortable but what about when you have a nightgown on?

    And btw,why would JR say that It's a nasty room.
    Just you didn't go in there.

    Is he playing mind games again trying to imply again that it wasn't THEM ,dettaching himself again from everything that happened?

    Something else........did you notice that JR seems to have a problem with details?I mean.........he sees the white blanket but he doesn't see the pink gown.......he sees AND unties the wrist ligature but he doesn't see the NECK ligature.........oh come on.......
  2. madeleine_ws

    madeleine_ws Member

    And I am sure I read somewhere about some blood spots found on the pink gown.Is it true.TIA
  3. Elle

    Elle Member

    Madeleine wrote:

    This was the room Patsy Ramsey supposedly wrapped her Christmas gifts in, Madeleine(?). This I don't believe! 100% lies from start to finish!
  4. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    In rereading some of the transcripts the other day, Patsy seemed to be indicating that she wrapped presents on the washer and dryer in the basement and stored the wrapped presents in the cellar (where nobody ever went except Fleet White, to hear her tell it).
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2010
  5. Texan

    Texan FFJ Senior Member

    neck ligature

    the neck ligature was hidden in the swollen neck tissue. Maybe he could have seen the rope ends hanging down but IF he didn't know about the garrotte he may not have registered what the rope ends were.
  6. Elle

    Elle Member

    Patsy Ramsey stated a few times she wrapped presents in that filthy dirty basement room. Unbelievable! Of all the rooms in this big house, she trails all the way down to this filthy dirty room to wrap presents (?). Was she covering her DNA being found there?

    Steve Thomas questioning Patsy Ramsey from the Police Files

  7. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    I agree she didn't do that. Elsewhere she refers to the laundry room as her wrapping station.

    I'm old enough to appreciate what kneeling on concrete does to your knees. In fact, I think they do something like it in Guantanamo: make prisoners kneel on concrete and wrap presents.
  8. DeeDee

    DeeDee Member

    She was covering for the fact that partially unwrapped presents were in that room. NOT in the laundry area, but in the wineceller. Now, I don't believe that she actually hid presents in that filthy room. But as most of us believe, those presents were brought in for the purpose of finding the replacement panties (bought for JB's older cousin). The stagers knew they were in one of the boxes. That's why I believe Patsy mentioned wrapping in there.
  9. madeleine_ws

    madeleine_ws Member

    I agree.And there is another thing that baffles me.Okay,maybe PR wasn't the housewife of the year,maybe she hated laundry and cleaning the house and stuff,still..........

    TOM HANEY: How about 378?

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: This is JonBenet's floor, her

    18 pants.

    19 TOM HANEY: Do you recall those particular

    20 pants, when she would have worn those last?

    21 PATSY RAMSEY: Not for sure. Probably

    22 recently because they are dropped in the middle of the

    23 floor, but I don't remember exactly.

    24 TOM HANEY: They are kind of inside out.

    25 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.


    1 TOM HANEY: 379 is a close up of it. It

    2 appears they are stained.

    3 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.

    4 TOM HANEY: Is that something that JonBenet

    5 had a problem with?

    6 PATSY RAMSEY: Well she, you know, she was at

    7 age where she was learning to wipe herself and, you

    8 know, sometimes she wouldn't do such a great job.

    9 TOM HANEY: Did she have accidents, if you

    10 will, in the course of the day or the night, as opposed

    11 to just bed wetting?

    12 PATSY RAMSEY: Not usually, no, huh-uh. That

    13 would probably be more from just not wiping real well.

    14 TOM HANEY: Okay. Do you know how long those

    15 would have been in that position in 378 on the floor in

    16 there?

    17 PATSY RAMSEY: It depends when she wore them

    18 last.

    19 TOM HANEY: Again, do you recall?

    20 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't remember.

    21 TOM HANEY: On Christmas day were you in that

    22 bathroom at all?

    23 PATSY RAMSEY: Very likely, but I can't say

    24 for sure.

    25 TOM HANEY: Had you been in there that day,


    1 would you have done something with them?

    2 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, I got, you know -- that

    3 night I got -- I know I got the long Johns for her out

    4 of that bathroom.

    5 TOM HANEY: Right, out of one of the draws in

    6 there.

    7 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah.

    8 TOM HANEY: Do you recall seeing those on the

    9 floor that night when you got the --

    10 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

    11 TOM HANEY: -- underwear.

    12 PATSY RAMSEY: They could have been there. I

    13 don't know.

    14 TOM HANEY: Could have.

    15 PATSY RAMSEY: Could have been there, yes.

    16 Don't know for sure.

    17 TOM HANEY: Is it possible that some point

    18 during the night she would have gotten up and put those

    19 on or thrown them down there or changed in some way;

    20 trying to account for those being there.

    21 PATSY RAMSEY: I just -- I can't imagine

    22 that. No, because I put those -- she was zonked out

    23 asleep, so I put her to bed. And she had those, she

    24 had worn the black velvet ones to Priscilla's.

    25 What she had on earlier that day, I just


    1 can't remember. It might have been those. I just

    2 can't remember. Could have taken those off, you know,

    3 gotten the dress to go to Priscilla's and then left

    4 them there.

    Stained pants in the middle of the floor and you just leave them there?Does this have to do with covering up another lies ...because this mother/wife sounds more like a single man living alone if you know what I mean....mess and dirty clothes everywhere,stained pants in the middle of the room,the bed was a total mess,the bathroom........something's not right.....
  10. AMES

    AMES Member

    The Nightgown

    I found it odd that in John's interview, he says that the pink nightgown "wasn't supposed to be there". What the heck is THAT supposed to mean. I have always thought that the blanket that she was found wrapped in, and the nightgown was in the dryer together. The pink nightgown became attached to the blanket via static cling, and because of all of the chaos that was going on right about that time, they didn't realize that the gown was attached. And that was what John meant by the gown "wasn't supposed to be there". If an INTRUDER had of actually killed her, how would John have known what was supposed to have been there, and what wasn't?? If it had of been a real intruder...maybe he MEANT to leave that night gown there, beside of her. SO, how did John know that it wasn't SUPPOSED to be there??? Because, IMO....when he or Patsy took the blanket out of the dryer, for her to be wrapped in...they had no clue that the pink nightgown was attached to it. My daughter used to have a nightgown like that...and it becomes very clingy in the dryer. It would attach itself to everything!!! Even with a dryer sheet!
  11. Karen

    Karen Member

    In my opinion he just meant it wasn't normally kept down there and it was out of place. Even if it clung to the blanket which sounds logical to me it was a mistake to have carried it down there on the blanket and so "it wasn't supposed to be there."
  12. Learnin

    Learnin Member

    Good point and pick up. Are they referring to panties or pants in this exchange?
  13. Elle

    Elle Member

    Yes, DeeDee, all part of Patsy's "confusion" plan.

    btw I received my order of Mark Fuhrman's book "The Murder Business" today, and I just finished reading Chapter Six "Death of a troubled Princess JonBenétRamsey. Just 24 pages. I'll take my time to read through the other murder cases.
  14. DeeDee

    DeeDee Member

    It's a fast read, Elle. You should enjoy it this weekend.
  15. DeeDee

    DeeDee Member

    Hard to say. From the dialog, they are definitely discussing a pair of JB's black pants that were pulled off and left on the floor. They also discuss staining with what can be assumed to be feces, because Patsy specifically mentions JB not wiping herself properly, and pants that are wet rather than soiled would not be apparent in a photo.
    I can't imaging a pair of pants being stained with feces from poor wiping if panties are worn under them. For the stain to reach the pants through the underwear, it'd have to be a lot more feces than results from poor wiping.
    Yet, they do not mention panties specifically. If the pants and panties were pulled off together, they could have been left on the floor with the panties still inside the pants.
    The housekeeper said that ALL the Rs were very sloppy, that they did not own a hamper, and all dirty clothes were usually left on the floor, even underwear. So this was nothing unusual for this household. Even Patsy's mother Nedra commented that she often berated Patsy for being so untidy, that it was difficult for the housekeeper to clean, because she was spending so much time just picking up after the family.
  16. Learnin

    Learnin Member

    Thanks, DeeDee.

    I wonder how one sees feces stain on black pants? Must've been a little more staining than normal.

    I have a question. I'm sure I've read this. The longjohns that JBR was found wearing. Did Patsy claim she got them out of the drawer and put them on JBR after JBR was put to bed asleep?
  17. DeeDee

    DeeDee Member

    Patsy said that she looked around for the pink pajama bottoms that JB had worn Christmas Eve and couldn't find them. (what looks like the pink top appears on JB's bed in a crime scene photo).
    So Patsy said she grabbed the long johns instead, leaving her in her white top she wore to the White's. I don't recall if she said she took them from a drawer.


    You can see the small pink garment in the photo near the headboard of her bed. As you can see, the pillow is at the foot of the bed. I think the reason for this is that. like a lot of little girls, JB kept pajamas under her pillow and Patsy WAS possibly looking for them. It looks like she pulled the pillow out of the way and only the top was there. The way I see it, JB was asleep in the car on the way home, but woke up when she got home and walked in (just as her brother BR said). Then, Patsy helped her ready for bed. I think then, JB had that pineapple snack (with Patsy's knowledge and help) and not too long after that...well- we all know what followed.
  18. Elle

    Elle Member

    Just scanned this DeeDee: The Police Files
  19. Elle

    Elle Member

    I bought this Hewlett Packard scanner months ago, but just realized that one can copy text which can be edited. This is hard to believe, but I just corrected a few words which were wrong in the actual copying. Has anyone else noticed this? Good grief, anyone can change the text from a book. !ouch:

    I thought at first the spelling errors were actually in The Police Files. Double checked and one of them was Trujillo saying "Okay" which came out as "Pkay" HONEST! I kid you not!

    Check out this same line with TT: Instead of the sentence reading ... What's the first thing you guys do when you got home that night?
    It has copied .... What's the first thing you guys do when you got home that ~ See what I mean "night?" is missing! I won't be copying any more pages like this DeeDee. I'll be here until the cows come home changing the errors. It has to be copyright, I'm thinking (?).

    I can't take this scanner back now. Anyone know anything about this ?
  20. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    You're scanning this in from a paperback? It seems like it's doing a pretty good job of recognizing characters.

    Unless you want to search or edit the text from this book, why not just bring the page in as an image?
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