John Ramsey's New Book - The Other Side of Suffering

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by Tricia, Jan 18, 2012.

  1. Moab

    Moab Admin Staff Member

    I was hoping you would tell us how you really felt...{{{sigh}}}

  2. Cherokee

    Cherokee FFJ Senior Member

    Ha ha ... if I told you how I REALLY felt, it might melt down the forum! ;)
  3. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    Welcome to the forum, and great memory you have there, QFT. :coffeeup:

    No lawyer ever got a tagline more deserving that Lin Wood: ATTORNEY FOR THE DAMNED.

    John Ramsey knows what happened and what he has done. He can build a six foot thick wall of false image, but it won't change the truth. EVER.
  4. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    Go ahead. We've got the firehose ready.

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  5. questfortrue

    questfortrue Member

    Thank you all for the welcome!
    A friend of mine paints special balloons for birthdays. But, uh oh, maybe I made a mistake in getting this for Cherokee’s next birthday.

  6. Cherokee

    Cherokee FFJ Senior Member

    Ha ha ... thanks KK, but those fire hoses don't have enough water to compensate you with!

  7. Cherokee

    Cherokee FFJ Senior Member


    Thank you, QFT, but you shouldn't have! No, really, YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE!!! :sick:

    I like how the second balloon is deflated. Reminds me of Lin Wood's forum nickname. Hmm ... speaking of compensation. Maybe THAT'S one reason Lin is such an egotistical bully.
  8. DeeDee

    DeeDee Member

    Glad to see you here, QFT. This forum is quieter than WS, so the more the merrier!
  9. Elle

    Elle Member

    I'm holding your Sari Zoomama!

    What a great post Zoomama! I'll hold your Sari for you while you barf! It's good you have read John Ramsey's latest book. I'm not into reading any books lately. Thanks
    for the update!
  10. questfortrue

    questfortrue Member

    Zoomama's excellent post

    The excellent post by Zoomama expressed what I felt, too. Phoney baloney for sure. It didn’t take long for me to feel like I should have changed my hat from Questfortrue (QFT) to Discoveringabucketofpoop. (Maybe there’s an emoticon for that.)

    Peering through the many lies of JR and PR and the deconstruction statements of lawyers (and the trolls!) it’s sort of like looking through layers of gauzy veils. And still I only see 3 people who are standing behind this. It must be that the remaining Rs believe there are enough veils that the reality of the crime is no longer visible. They would be wrong in that assumption, imo.

    I know this is not an original thought, but here’s the reason I believe the R game plan for image control won’t pan out in the end. The cold case will follow the Rs forever. PR and JR, in their clever scheme, did not compute that their fabulistic staging, desecration of their daughter and ongoing explanations would be so contemptibly huge, the case would be written about and discussed for decades. And then what. Well there are entities like the Vidocq Society.

    It was interesting that in the case of the Vidocq Society, one of the founders – Richard Walter - said he was sick of people asking him who killed JonBenet. This was in 2010, after Patsy had died. Walter claims to know who killed JonBenet, but he’s not talking about it. Currently, Walter is working on a cold case of almost 60 years. Walter is investigating it purely on the basis that it is a mystery needing to be solved, not because any family has requested an investigation.

    Message to JR: Did it ever occur to you that the case will still follow the family after you’ve departed earth? Oh, the injustice of it, that he can’t sue from the grave! Okay, guess we can be grateful that no-one would sink so low as to dig ‘m up for a lawsuit. :rolleyes:

    Only my opinions
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2014
  11. DeeDee

    DeeDee Member

    To those who say they know who killed JB but won't say....

    They either CAN'T say because it was Burke and they legally cannot accuse or blame him, or they don't really know. There is really no other choice.
    Patsy's sister also claims she "knows". Believe me, if Patsy's sister knows, and it was an intruder (including someone known to the family) she would say it. Knowing of a crime and refusing to reveal that information is a crime in itself. So as far as she is concerned- it is either a family member -including someone legally protected from prosecution or dead- or she doesn't really know. I can see no legitimate reason why she would keep such information to herself and not tell police unless it is what I said- she is protecting a family member.
    I am sure Patsy told her sister the truth about what happened that night at some point before she died, and that is why Aunt P makes the claim that she "knows". Frankly-I believe that she DOES know. So did the Grand jury, the police, Lou Smit, the DA's office and the defense team. THEY. ALL. KNOW.
  12. questfortrue

    questfortrue Member

    Totally agree with you about who knows. Boulder doesn’t want any outside help on this. They don’t want anyone to ‘solve’ it, too many hands who’ve stirred the soup. They want this to just go away.

    As far as Walter’s comment, that would really be a fair conclusion. But a little more should be mentioned about Vidocq. Vidocq does not interfere with any law agency investigation unless invited. Boulder never invited them, though I think one of their members did do a review of the RN and offer to talk to Boulder about it. I don’t believe anything came of it, but we wouldn’t know since they operate behind the scenes. They do not talk to the press, or publish any conclusions, until they have solved an abandoned cold case crime to their own standards. Walter not talking more about it could be just as you say, or it may simply reflect the general policy of their society. And as per their policy, Walter shouldn’t have even said as much as he did. I’m not sure if it was a slip or what.

    My theory is leaving this case cold does not suppress folks wondering who was responsible, nor will it stop an organization like Vidocq from looking at it way down the line. At that point, the public perception tide may change; MSM can be a fickle partner. (Yikes, I hope mentioning this on a public forum doesn’t inspire someone (JR) to write another book, “Listen carefully, I am, I really am the best Christian ever.€ :censored: :sick: )
  13. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    As I mentioned previously, a psalm very closely related to Psalm 35, is one of special significance to Patsy--Psalm 57. In DOI, Patsy says that before her cancer treatment she picked up the hotel room's Gideon Bible, opened it and pointed to a verse at random, a verse from Psalm 57, "In the shadow of your wings, I will make my refuge, / Until these calamities have passed by." She felt that this was a message from God.

    Psalm 57 in the Ramsey Bible is laid out like Psalm 35, i.e., the cross references are in the middle of the page. That special verse from Psalm 57 (not shown) is on the same page and close to a cross reference to Psalm 35:17. That verse, 35:17, is on the page that the Bible was found open to.

    I think Patsy may have used the same magic ritual she used to get guidance from God before her first cancer treatment: She opened her Bible to Psalm 57 and jabbed her finger into the page; landed on "Ps 35:17" and that's where she went. There really aren't any good initialisms on that page--LOIL doesn't sound much like a foreign faction. Whatever the reason, she used the first letters of the first lines of Psalm 35 for her foreign faction.

    I have to assume that Team Ramsey didn't know that the police had discovered the origins of "SBTC" when DOI was published. That would mean that their moles in the DA's office hadn't told them. And JonBenet, where it was revealed to the public, was published after DOI. Reading that must have been an unpleasant shock.​

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  14. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    When Team Ramsey found out that the "intruder" had touched (or might have touched) at least one page in the Bible, why didn't they clamor for fingerprint and DNA testing of the Bible? The Ramseys had it in their possession because Pam Paugh removed it from the house after the murder.

    Even if Lou Smit or other Ramsey moles kept this information under their hats, everybody knew about Psalm 35 when JonBenet was published in 2000. Testing would have been worth a shot, wouldn't it?​
  15. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    What's not visible in the photograph of the Bible page is that the bottom of each page in the NIV Study Bible is devoted to commentary on the Bible text above. The commentary below Psalm 34 describes it as an acrostic psalm. That commentary is visible when the Bible is open to the beginning of Psalm 35. I think that was the inspiration for Patsy to use the first letters of the first lines of Psalm 35, visible on the facing page, for her sign-off.

    Psalm 34 comes up frequently in The Other Side of Suffering. Not only does John say he read this rather hair-raising psalm to Patsy on her deathbed, a couple of the chapter headings use lines from 34. That's a lot of Psalm 34 for one book, given that he had 150 psalms to choose from (not to mention the whole rest of the Bible).

    Maybe the frequent references to Psalm 34 in TOSOS were setting the stage for a claim that the Bible was already open to Psalms 34/35 and the intruder noticed it in the hours he was supposedly lolling around the house. The question remains: Once it became known that there was even a possibility an intruder was hovering over that Bible, why not submit it for DNA testing and maybe fingerprint testing?

    When John found out that Psalm 35 was the source of "S.B.T.C," he should have been slapping his forehead and saying, "Holy cow! That's right next to my favorite psalm!" Instead there's a weird silence from Team Ramsey. Lin Wood didn't ask Steve Thomas about Psalm 35 and "SBTC," even though he did ask about the Thomas's mention in JonBenet of an earlier effort to find "SBTC" in Ramsey business documents.

    (And looking at 34/35 in that Bible again, you don't actually have to go to the commentary for a description of Psalm 34 as an acrostic. It's at the bottom of the Bible text on the page facing Psalm 35. It's set off almost by itself and says, "This psalm is an acrostic poem, the verses of which begin with successive letters of the Hebrew alphabet." You can see the "in" of "begin" in the photo across from "Evil will slay the wicked....")​
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2016
  16. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    Just fixing a typo in my original post.​
  17. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    I discovered yesterday that Psalm 35 is sometimes known as "Prayer for Victory." That's important because of "Victory! S.B.T.C" at the end of the ransom note​
  18. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    In 2006 I took a summer Photoshop class at a community college. I had a student license for Photoshop CS, Patsy Ramsey had just died, and since we hadn't worked with Photoshop filters in class, I decided to play around with the cheek and back marks at home.

    The cheek mark became my avatar. I could generate it with just a few clicks. The back marks gave me less joy--or so I thought. I zoomed in on a small portion of the upper figure and worked with that. I applied a Gaussian blur and an edge-finding function. I did this and that. Because zoomed in the image didn't look like much I didn't even intend to save my work, but I inadvertently did. When I opened the file again the next day and zoomed out, I had the rather ghostly image that I'm including here.

    Our version of Photoshop CS did not provide a history which survived the closing of the file so I didn't know exactly what I had done and in what sequence. I knew I had confined myself to blurs, an edge-finding function and maybe some sharpening functions. I thought the results were interesting enough to contact BPD, Beckner, I think, who referred me to the DA, who had an investigator contact me. I talked to (or emailed with) a guy I recognized from TV. At the end I assumed that someone with expertise would do an enhancement of at least the back marks. So I was surprised when I read about Kolar's train track theory years later. (If memory serves, in his book Kolar described the marks as "circular and somewhat rectangular." I thought that was interesting because my enhancement more or less agrees, though I didn't see that in the crime scene photo.)

    The back mark image is below. I added the line and text yesterday.


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    Last edited: Sep 24, 2016
  19. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    I was looking through tv guide Dec. 21-27, 1996, for something else (which turned out not to be there) when I noticed a show called Victory! With Billy Joe and Sharon Daugherty. (The listing includes the "!.") It's a religious program which showed several times that week.

    DrollForeignFaction on websleuths posted in 2017 that Andrew Hodges said that Patsy watched that program. (I don't see that he attributes the remark to Judith Phillips, though.) It does seem like a show like that would be up Patsy's alley.​
  20. fr brown

    fr brown Member

    I'm including a photo of Psalm 57 in the 1985 NIV Study Bible, the Bible (and edition, I think) that was open on the desk in the study adjoining the bedroom. Visible is Patsy's magical verse and nearby is the cross-reference to Ps 35:17. It's a cross-reference to a similar line in Psalm 35 describing enemies as lions. Visible also is the verse about the pit digging, net spreading and pratfalling of enemies into the pits they've just dug. While there's no cross-reference in 57 to that same imagery in Psalm 35, it does exist there.

    (Psalm 35 doesn't include any cross-references to Psalm 57.) ​

    Psalm 57 with xref cropped.jpg
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