New Court TV Special - JonBenet

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by VP, Jun 28, 2006.

  1. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    You hit on some things I was pondering, as well, Greenleaf.

    Like the pineapple that the Ramseys denied. Some facts about that pineapple were skewed in this show, as well. The narrator said the pineapple bowl wasn't noticed in the picture until MONTHS LATER. But Thomas said they tested it against the pineapple in the fridge. How did they do that if it was months later? Did they keep the fridge contents all that time. Strange.

    Then you think about this: there were kids going in and out all afternoon, according the the Ramseys. But none of them had their fingerprints on the bowl and glass. So maybe Burke took it out and got himself some tea. I know it's not usual to make tea in a glass like that, as you make it in a pitcher after boiling the water with the tea in it. If it was usual, seems like someone who knows the family well would know that, especially if that's how Patsy or Burke fixed it in front of them or for them. Did LE ask ANYONE ELSE that knew the Ramseys well if that was the case? Or could someone have made it while waiting around for the kidnapper to call? A victim advocate? Mrs. Fernie or Mrs. White? Maybe Burke had touched the glass, but his DNA wouldn't have been on the lip unless he drank from it, more than likely. 2 million dollars and LE doesn't even know the answer to THIS?

    Anyone know where Judith Phillips is these days?
  2. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    Here's what creeped me out. Did you see John describing the blanket wrapped around JonBenet? He used his hands, and crossed them in front of he was wrapping the blanket himself.

    I'm sorry, but flags were going up for me. How much time did he take looking at her "wrappings"? I would imagine he didn't stand there taking notes. He took the duct tape off. He fiddled with the wrist ligature, trying to remove it. He picked her up and took her upstairs. This bothers me. He seems to have known a lot about how she was wrapped. Probalby nothing, me wondering.

    Then there was the stuff about the head blow coming from a man. There was only one man in the house that night we know for sure.

    Yeah, I thought the first part went well...right up until they brought Smit in. Why doesn't someone tell that bag of bones to take his brilliant self to the friends and family of the Ramseys and ask them if they fixed tea in a glass with a bag. And while he's at it, tell him to get his patron saint Keenan to subpoena the phone records out of the BPD evidence room so they can hurry up and burn them if they prove anything incriminating against the Ramseys.

    Look, now that we know Hunter obstructed LE from getting any of the Ramseys phone records, which is DAY TWO elementary stuff in a murder case like this, I think it's safe to bet the farm Hunter was sandbagging this case from the first phone call he got from his hot tubby buddies. The good old boys club circled the wagons and they all made a to speak.

  3. Cranberry

    Cranberry Member

    The cord fiber on the bed was confirmed also. Could it be transfer from something she had on her bed and not from the bindings?
  4. Cranberry

    Cranberry Member

    In the search warrant for MI (for additional handwriting samples-3/97 I think) it states JR handed "pads" over to Det Patterson, that one of those pads included the practice note and the tear marks at the top aligned. Thank you ACandyRose
  5. Cranberry

    Cranberry Member

    Sorry, just one more post. The 6/98 PR interview line 462 (photo # 382) mentions a basket by (or on?) the bar/table by the spiral staircase with papers/mail/and in another photo also a pen. Not a wastebasket but basket, if this has anything to do w/the pad in the wastebasket, not sure.
  6. wombat

    wombat Member

    I slept on it - here are a few impressions:

    Patsy had execrable decorating taste, and that house was a pigsty. What was with the flower patterns upon flower patterns? All the greens and pinks and roses? Striped wallpaper and flowered chintz upholstery? Eeew. Not for me. How do you get a man to live in a house like that?

    Also, I know it was Christmas, but nobody picks up before going to bed? Crap on the floors, crap on the kitchen counter, crap in the hallways. No wonder they couldn't take care of a dog - they had no discipline in their housekeepiing. If my dog lived there he would have eaten the pineapple, by the way (and there would have been no intruder, or a dead one).

    The mess makes me think about how "at home" Patsy was at home. Whatever happened, only she really could have wandered around that house and found a sharpie pen, a pad of paper, a cord, a paintbursh, duct tape...
    A couple of the speakers, including the FBI agent, said that the house itself was a behavioral clue due to its maze-like floorplans, and I also think the huge amount of CRAP present is a personal statement by the lady of the house.

    Which brings me to the tea glass. I think the tea was made in a mug at the kitchen stove, like normal people do, and then walked over to the breakfast nook, steeped, and then flung in the glass to be picked up later by the cleaning faeries they seemed to be expecting. I don't think tea was made in the glass.

    Another thing that impressed me was this Werner Spitz guy - "no bat, no stick - this was made by a flashlight" - paraphrasing - and the mag light exactly fits the displaced section of the head wound. But no stuff on the mag light connects it to her head. I have about six mag lights at home and at work and I guarantee there's stuff on all of them. They are very sturdy and don't break. (once I dropped one off the top of the George Washington Bridge and it still worked, but that's another story.) The mag light was found on the kitchen counter near the sink, apparently the only thing in the house that was clean as a whistle. It was too big to smuggle out of the house later.
  7. RiverRat

    RiverRat FFJ Sr. Member Extraordinaire (Pictured at Lef


    Even on the inside as the batteries were wiped off.

  8. sboyd

    sboyd Member

    The batteries were wiped off? That should tell everyone a lot. It does me. Where did you find that?
  9. "J_R"

    "J_R" Shutter Bug Bee

    Do we know who was actually at the Ramsey house Christmas morning? Also, am I wrong or are there two people standing to the right of the Christmas Tree? I have clipped the picture and drawn arrows where I believe they are. There may even be a third person slightly hidden behind the tree and to the left of this area.

    Attached Files:

  10. Elle

    Elle Member

    <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by koldkase
    Hang on...did I have a brain cloud? The PAD was IN THE WASTEBASKET? The RANSOM NOTE PAD?

    Because I thought John handed that to LE. I've missed something here, haven't I?

    I see Dr. Lee answered my question about DNA testing on the glass and spoon. NO, BPD nor BDA has done DNA testing on EITHER. How Boulder of them. Why bother to get an actual answer to a question they've been asking FOR YEARS?


    KK A photograph on Christmas night was taken by John Ramsey himself as he was finishing of his roll of film, showing two white lined legal pads. One of them had been used to write the ransom note. It was Patsy's containing her doodles and the so called practice note.

    This photo was shown to Patsy Ramsey by Detective Haney during her police interview. Police Files page 247-248


    1.The proof is already there in this photo where this pad was before JonBenét's murder. Police Files page 247 - 248

    2. Page 33 -34 Steve Thomas "JonBenét."

    The case was breaking wide open on two different fronts. About the same time Ramsey found the body of his daughter, a detective discovered what would mark a turning point in the investigation, the existence of a possible practice note in a tablet belonging to Patsy Ramsey.

    When Sergeant Bob Whitson had arrived at the house, he asked for handwriting samples of John and Patsy Ramsey, standard procedure to begin eliminating people as possible authors of the ransom note. Without hesitation John Ramsey had picked up two tablets of white lined paper - one from a countertop and the other from a hallway table a few steps from the spiral staircase - and handed them to the policeman, Whitson scribbled John across the top of one, which contained business notes Ramsey said he made, and Patsy atop the second, on which the first four pages were covered with doodles, lists and other writing in a feminine hand. Both pads were taken to the police department and given to Detective Jeff Kithcart, our forgery and fraud investigator, who put them aside while he completed more pressing jobs.

    Just before the big briefing was to begin, Kithcart reviewed the tablets. They seemed ordinary enough, apparently the same kind of paper on which the ransom note had been written. He flipped through the one bearing the word Patsy and, in the middle, noticed a page with a partial salutation written by a black felt-tip pen.

    Mr. and Mrs. I

    The single vertical line seemed as if it could be the downstroke that would start the capital letter R. To Kithcart it looked like the start of another ransom note, and it was in a tablet belonging to the mother of the missing child. How did it get in there? He quickly headed toward the conference room, thinking that perhaps something more than a kidnapping was at work, but before he could share his find, the code Black came in. Page 34
  11. Why_Nut

    Why_Nut FFJ Senior Member

    So this is the context in which the famous pineapple bowl was found.




    It sure does not sell the intruder theory to me. Also, the disparity between the size of the bowl and the size of the spoon is not nearly as drastic as I thought it would be. I thought I would be seeing a virtual ladle inside a tiny bowl, and instead I see a large-ish spoon that seems appropriate for large chunks of pineapple instead of little tiny cut-up chunks.

    Edited to add: There seems to be more than one teabag in that glass. Almost as if someone had mug after mug of tea to keep themselves going during, say, the process of writing a ransom note at two or three or four in the morning, and used the glass not to drink from, but to put used teabags in to keep them from staining the glass of the tabletop.
  12. Cookie

    Cookie Member

    Couldn't Watch It

    I couldn't watch Schiller's Court TV program. I just didn't want to hear his BS. This is a man, who I believe, would sell his soul for a story. I believe he is sucking up to this insane "intruder theory" to get an exclusive on an interview with JR, or even another book deal , and/or another TV movie.

    When anxiously awaiting for his first book, then movie, I believed he would nail the RAMS. Instead, he soft pedaled their guilt in the entire affair.

    Here's my photo of him that was taken before his book was released.

    Attached Files:

  13. The Punisher

    The Punisher Member

    Cookie, you have good reason to be upset. We all do. They made no mention of the evidence that led back to the Ramseys. They could have challenged it, by all means, but at least get it out there.

    I've often thought we should do out own one of these.
  14. Jayelles

    Jayelles Alert Viewer in Scotland

    I've only one thing to say about the teabag. Do they know that tea was drunk from the glass? because I toss used teabags into any nearby receptacle to stop them dripping over the place. I then/later transport them to the bin using the receptacle.

    i.e. it wouldn't be unusual to find a used teabag in a dirty glass in my kitchen - but the glass wouldn't have been used to drink the tea.
  15. Elle

    Elle Member

    For sure, it doesn't look like a little six year old would bother putting this on a table by herself. More like something a mother would do, but unfortunately I heard the kitchen was cleaned up by one of the friends, so who knows what was where?

    I believe Patsy also bought the fresh type of pineapple with the the outer jagged layer cut off, so they usually just sell it uncut in our supermarket, so Patsy probably cut it up in big chunks herself.
  16. Elle

    Elle Member

    Come to think of it, Jay. We do the same here.
  17. Why_Nut

    Why_Nut FFJ Senior Member

    And here. Until thrown away, the resting place for a drippy teabag is a glass or, ironically, the bowl of a large spoon.
  18. RiverRat

    RiverRat FFJ Sr. Member Extraordinaire (Pictured at Lef

    It was one of the Victim Advocate's that wiped up the kitchen.

  19. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    Great photo, Judith. You really have a gift. No wonder Patsy was jealous.

    I am going to go out on a limb here, and without checking again cause there's so much to catch up on today, and in light of being too tired when I saw the show last night to say for sure I'm not confused...again...with all the NEWLY CREATED EVIDENCE BS, but....

    I could swear when it showed Patsy in those DA interviews talking about that tea bag, she said "I would never put a tea bag in a CUP like that."

    Of course, if I'm not imagining it, she misspoke. But I am pondering why she said cup and not glass.

    Thanks, Elle, for documenting that about the pad. We all KNOW that everything we've read for years said that John handed the pad to LE. We've discussed it no less than a thousand times. So WHAT is wrong with Schiller? Does he NOT have a FACT CHECKER when he's doing something like this? Or is he just that careless?

    I mean, does this case need ANOTHER person screwing up the facts about the evidence in a whole new way? Sheesh!
  20. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    Not here. I use a saucer with a cup. That way, you have a place for the drippy spoon, for sugar/honey/lemon, and the tea bag.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice