The Cult of JonBenet and why Mark Beckner loves us (not)

FreeBitch

LOL - I guess some do take offense at being labeled the B-word, personally, I loved that was your response!

RR

 

Aha - you can curse in this area, dammit!

If there is a will, there is a way.

RR

 

Re: FreeBitch

I laughed at your post RR because there are days when I fit the bill. Only I can get away with calling myself "An old " ...I'd rather be a Rich !

btw way I was brought up in Scotland, and it isn't swearing over there to call someone "A stupid ." Long time ago, for sure! No one gave it a second thought. This may have changed. I'll need to check this out.

 

Nice article!

A lot of work went into this piece and the author showed all sides. Congrats to those who were quoted. I do have a queasy feeling thinking there may be such a young person interacting on the forums. From my POV on cases, I would be hesitant to talk about certain elements of crimes to a minor. But that's the nature of public forums, I guess. Reader beware.

I don't blame law enforcement for looking askew at public forums. We've seen many examples of the harm that can be done. And look how certain Boulder personnel are still ravaged for the completely natural process of looking to the press for help. In this one particular case, the "journalist" wasn't credible, but the outreach certainly was. It happens all the time, though it seldom gets publicized as it did in the Ramsey case.

Cops and prosecutors are always open to new ideas. The Internet is certainly having an impact on crime fighting, but through private --not public-- forums. Many cops have forums, as do DAs, defense lawyers, forensic scientists, lab workers, and the like -- the people who solve crimes on a daily basis! They share info, clue others to new techniques, and pass along their victories in court. But there's no anonymity, which is what makes the public forums so untrustworthy.

I think the best we can accomplish is to have our good work or theories linked to those "insider" forums. There are some great minds here at FFJ with angles that deserve exposure to serious sleuths. There may never be a pat on the back or public acknowledgment that one's work has made a difference, but when you follow a case through to the end you might see that you have made a contribution. To most of us here I think that would be meaningful.

When a professional is linked here and sticks around to take a look at other threads, I would hope they find more wheat than chaff. As much fun as some of the frivolous threads are (and I engage in them too), we should ask ourselves if they represent our best efforts. I know it's a tough balance, trying to stay user-friendly and still on topic. But if we wish to gain respectability, we have to raise the bar.

 

Ok, now from the peanut gallery---

1. What the hell is a 9 year old kid doing getting involved in a homicide case like this with people like Jameson? Where are this child's parents? Do they know/have they read what Jameson's personal history is and what her role in this case has consistently been????

2. The article was interesting in that females following this case do so only because they are either (a) mothers, or (b) victims of sexual abuse; whereas, males following this case do so for only one reason--true crime sleuthing. Pardon me? Can't both genders be any combination of those things and still follow this case? Ok, so men can't be mothers (well, I would beg to differ LOL) but you know what I mean.

3. Bobc's here just for the friendships. Well, ok, now Bob, you've been self-sleuthed and I have to ask, was it good for you? LOL

4. RR, you and me think very much alike. I don't need crime forums to provide friendships, so have always been here for the cases and the victims, truth, justice and the American way. The friends I've made along the way are far more precious to me than the many enemies I've also made, but it's the collective that will advance the case, friendships and all. So let's all hold hands now and sing "Kum Bya", k? Now turn to the person on your right and HUG!!!

6. All in all, Ebert and Roper give the article two thumbs up. Thanks to the journalist for all his hard work!

P.S. Beckner, like Limp Wood, the Ramseys and the devil can kiss my rosey red cheek.....

 

As much fun as some of the frivolous threads are (and I engage in them too), we should ask ourselves if they represent our best efforts....

They do for me, .....I don't think we need to be Delta Dawns sitting here in our pearls and high heels in the hope that LE is gonna pop in sometime and look us over.


I know it's a tough balance, trying to stay user-friendly and still on topic. But if we wish to gain respectability, we have to raise the bar.

I bet your a real blast at parties....lol

 

Fed, please illuminate me on which posts are "frivolous?" And please enlighten me as to who decides what are and aren't. Many of the off-case threads have been a remarkable source of camaraderie, comfort and humor in what otherwise would be a continual barrage of tortured dead children all over the country.

Raise the bar? Honey, if the bar got any higher than FFJ, we'd ALL have to stand on self-appointed soapboxes just to get a drink.....

 

Going for the greater good here...

If you can't identify frivolous threads, I can't help you! Maybe privatizing them is an idea.

The fellowship here is tremendous -- I'm not suggesting that be eliminated and I'm not trying to insult anyone. These comments are offered with affection and out of a sincere attempt to see a bigger picture. Isn't that what this thread is about?

Everyone benefits from more elevated discussions -- that's not being elitist. To attract people who WORK IN THE SYSTEM we have to be mindful of their time and patience.

I don't know if there are people posting here who actually do this work day in and day out, as I do. Doesn't make me better (or worse), it's just a fact. I'm sure there are lurkers and more to come, and I know there are at least two people with a legal background (DejaNu and Ginja). Folks who work hard-core crime cases want to have a good time too, but they also like to talk crime and lots of it. It's kind of always "there."

If we're trying to impress law enforcement professionals, the best way is to get more of them to read here and maybe post. That means dazzling with our opinions and work, and staying aware of our public "face." There's always room for improvement. I would like to see new members with practical prosecutor experience, hopefully in high profile cases, because that beat is missing. It's hard to get people who are in court all day, but they find time to post elsewhere. If we get folks who are retired, they may not know state-of-the-art courtroom practices and media. But if we keep posting smart threads, we'll attract real players.

Say what you will about Jams, but her van Dam forum was excellent (I'm not including her opinion on the case which I disagreed with). She posted transcripts, news releases, crisp topics and there was heavy traffic. We missed that boat, and I don't know why.

Often we achieve that with our Ramsey threads, but right now there are a number of other cases going on that have significant medicolegal aspects which we're ignoring. Laci Peterson, Richard Tuite, Jayson Williams, Kobe Bryant, Michael Jackson, and on and on. Lurker has brought a couple cases to the forum and has reached out to new posters because there seems to be little interest among our regulars. Dig in, read up, participate! These cases are endlessly interesting.

Also if we wish respect from LE, there has to be a better understanding of how the system works. Posts which criticize DAs without any attempt to see why decisions are made are going to stir up civilians but turn off people who live in that world, even the cops who fight DAs daily. The reality is every now and then frogs need to be kissed. We may never learn exactly why decisions are made, but rather than take potshots, why not spitball reasons things may be in play? We haven't learned all there is to know. And even if we have, tomorrow there'll be new stuff.

 

I have to say FED you've just managed to make me feel most unwelcome here.

I only post frivolous posts.
I'm not in LE work which seems to be the kind of people you want on this board....only the professionals.

Your ok with putting us non-professionals in some hidden back room to play with ourselves so we don't embaress you in public. How nice...I'll pass.

 

Don't ya love Report Cards?!

Especially when you are not expecting to receive one!

Follow the Bouncing Ball - a child is murdered - her parents didn't want to talk about it for four months unless it was pre-taped on CNN. Come to find out, they had the support of the authorities in charge of PROSECUTING the person responsible. The Cops had no chance of making an arrest. We were flat-out told that there was a cover-up occuring.......and ya all know what happens to the Messenger. Also - The Tabloids infiltrated all areas in this case and didn't produce anything other than more copies sold.

FFJ members - The Ball Stops here. Until we are able to solve this crime from our collective homes across the Land, you will endure abuse and ridicule from all around. Never mind that fact that we had nothing to do with the cluster-phuck I referenced in the above paragraph, we will take their blame and Responsibilities.

But Ohhhhhh, the friendships you will make!

RR

 

Is that our purpose?

I know Tricia has a wonderful new program called "Virtual Gumshoes" about ready to hit the airwaves that is meant specifically to work with LE on cold cases and whatever else our Forum Goddess has in store for us. Those forums are something that will definitely raise the bar and concentrate on specific cases.

FFJ is a product of all those discussion forums that came before - a place where a bunch of people who get along just fine, for the most part, gather to discuss JBR and other cases but also a place where there is genuine passion for life and for what's going on in one another's lives. There has to be a social aspect to FFJ; otherwise, why bother? If I want to attend serious meetings all day, I'll go to work.

jameson did have a decent van Dam forum going, which she ruined with her own indecency and attacks against real victims - the van Dams. The fact that the clientele at that forum were not her regular posters but others who were enticed there by jameson and left when the case was over is indicative of how much credibility that forum had.

I don't think FFJ, as it stands right now, is here for the expressed purpose of earning respect from LE, although I know that is what Tricia strives for. Virtual Gumshoes is another bird, but I do not want to feel uncomfortable in my cyberhome (FFJ) thinking I have to write to gain attention from LE for my brilliance or fantastic ideas or continually being on edge in order to impress the big fellas.

Cops are no different than anyone else. I raised a damn good cop, but she puts her clothes on the same way as anyone else does, and she will be the first one to tell you that. Cops wear a uniform and carry a gun, but that doesn't make them smarter, wiser, more respectable...In fact, I'll go so far as to say it goes both ways. I've seen cops who didn't know enough to come in out of a good hard rain, too. Respect goes both ways, too, and anyone who looks at us as second class citizens shouldn't expect much respect back.

I don't think the mother board of FFJ has to change to suit anyone except our Forum Goddess. Those in law enforcement who do read the forums to ferret out worthwhile posts are not those with the huge egos and superior attitudes. Rather they are the ones who are hungry for information and know that somewhere, someone has an idea they haven't thought of. This is our home, and in our home there is more than work. There is play, too.

Virtual Gumshoes is the place to be for serious case discussion when it gets off the ground. In the meantime, if we want to be frivoulous in our own home, that's our privilege.

 

Oh, BTW

if you ever want to see real gallows humor, be a fly on the wall of a cop shop sometime. I can tell you that LE puts us to shame when it comes to really down and dirty jokes and general cutting up, even in the midst of the most horrible crime investigations.

That I have seen and heard with mine own eyes and ears. Carrion, friends, cops are not robots, they have real lives, too.

 

Fed, I think if you are so unhappy here with us ******* retirees and "non-professionals" you should go start your own forum where you can be queen. You have no idea who alot of us are or where we are in our lives, professionally or personally. The difference between us and you is that we don't have to be constantly promoting ourselves as superior, we're just here. And most of us have given a tremendous amount of time, money, effort and materials to establish our forum home and do honest work on these cases. And your contribution would be????? Oh yeah, insults.

Before you start that forum, you better learn how to stop deifying cops, DAs and yourself. You're one of those people who are on the outside looking in and salivating to belong. Go back to college, get some degrees, and go be a lawyer or a cop yourself. Sitting around courtrooms all day writing about us doesn't make you one of us or our official spokesperson. I think the cops and lawyers and other professionals at this forum do that quite well on their own. And the "non-professionals" here are quite impressive just the way they are. Get over it.

 

Fedx, I'm one of the older Seniors here, and I have been posting on the JonBenét forums for three years now. I can assure you I take the research for Justice for JonBenét very seriously, and I feel good when I have found the information someone else is looking for. I know the other posters feel the same.

I don't have legal expertise but I have learned a lot from all of those who know more about that here. Delmar England helps me out a lot too. It would be difficult for FFJ to recruit just those with legal experience in court, as members, don't you think?

 

The best advice

I ever read about the JBR case was written on the FFJ forum. Take the JBR case away from Keenan and her crew of Ramsey-loving investigators and give it to an independent prosecutor with independent investigators who have no Ramsey baggage, one way or the other. It is the single most important piece of advice that anyone in law enforcement circles could read the only thing that is going to get this case out of the surreal world of Boulder.

I know there are some who think the DA's office has always been on the up and up, but I'm here to tell you, it isn't, and it hasn't been, and some can't see it or refuse to see it, but it's so obvious, if it were a bear, it would walk right up to you and bite you.

 

All right...

I was under the impression, because I was specifically told, that the idea was to attract LE. I based my views on that, and on my own schedule which is rapidly getting busier.

I'm sad that it's come to this, but I have tried all I can to inspire, educate and be a real friend. I realize the fact that I am anonymous may be difficult for some of you when it comes to understanding my views. I will live with that, rather than going the self-aggrandizing route. That's never been my style, DejaNu. Others know words of wisdom when they read them.

I wish you all good luck and hope we can see the Ramsey case in a courtroom one day.

 

FedX...I hear you.

We should probably have another forum area for our lighter threads. Like we used to have The Jury Room at BNF (was that it?), and The Workout Room at JW, or The Coffee Shop, or whatever. A place to go to let down our hair.

I'll be honest...sometimes when I want to discuss crime topics other than Ramsey, I wander off the reservation to a more serious venue.

I spent months on the Court-TV Board posting on the Louisiana serial killer, until he was caught. Some of the posters there were the parents of the victims. Believe me, you don't get frivolous in that kind of atmosphere.

Anyone want to discuss the BTK from Wichita?

 

Re: Re: FreeBitch

The B word is pretty offensive here. It's considered a truly personal insult to call someone a stupid B - yet to use the B word as an adjective or verb isn't so bad - "She's just being B..y" or "They're B..ing about the boss".

I tend to use the B word as sparingly as the F word!

 

Fed, while it's pretty clear you are targeting me on this thread with these continual insults, there are a number of others who take exception to your stinging, condescending and sometimes outright inflammatory remarks, and have stated so on several threads. That is not "real friendship" or wisdom. Your anonymity plays no part in any difficulty understanding your views. You have made them as clear as the nose on your face.

While there is always room for improvement on this forum, and life in general, you seem to believe you are exempt from it. Not true. I suggest you take your own advice to heart and wish you well wherever you land.