Why the Molester/intruder Theory doesn't work

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by Ploppy_Slopper, Aug 19, 2006.

  1. I'm new here so i apologize in advance if this post contains any repitition of ideas or observations already posted in the forum.

    Here are my thoughts on why John Karr or any other child molester could not have murdered JBR.

    Lets imagine that the killer really was a sex offender. He would've gone to the house to gain access to the child, that would've been his primary and probably only motive in going there.

    He would've had to break in undetected, gone upstairs in the dark and fetched the child - lets suppose that so far he has been successful - now what? Any sex offender in this situation would've taken the child to another location before beginning his assault, why? Because molesters like to be in control of their victims and their surroundings, no molester/intruder would've stayed in an unfamiliar house, on Christmas and abused the child right there, putting himself in danger of being caught. He would've liked to take his time living out his fantasy, not rush it.

    Let's ignore that piece of logic and move on. Supposing that he did molest her there, why kill her? I know, I know, it was an "accident". But then, why stage the body? Why hide it out of sight? A stranger would've left the body as it was and ran as fast as possible.. but this one doesn't. He spends EVEN MORE time in the house, putting himself in further danger of being caught to elaborately stage and hide the body. An intruder would not benefit from this in any way.

    Moving on.
    Supposing he did stage and hide the body, the next obvious thing to do would've been to leave. And yet, he stays. Why is the intruder hesitating to leave a dangerous crime scene? Instead of sneaking out he goes into the kitchen and sits down to write a note... well, more like a letter. A sex offender is motivated by sex, not money. When a molestor abducts a child from their home in the middle of the night, it is very unlikely that they have any intention of returning the child, because they see it as their property.
    If the child was already dead, he would have no reason to even write a ransom note. That establishes that the note was not written in a serious attempt to make an actual exchange of the victim for the ransom.

    So why write the note? Why leave more evidence for the police?
    The note accomplishes two things:

    a)identifies the killer as an outsider;
    b)takes responsibility for the child's disappearance and demise.

    Why would an intruder do that? Why would an outsider call attention to the fact that he was an outsider? Why would he take responsibility for the child's disappearance? He wouldn't.

    Excusing all the previous "blunders" he would've had to commit to get to this point, the note is one mistake no sane criminal would make.
    Without the note, the body would be found in the house and suspicion would naturally fall on... the family. Why would an outsider want to divert attention away from them and onto himself? He wouldn't and he didn't.

    The killer wrote the note out of necessity. He wrote it because HE HAD TO. HE HAD NO OTHER CHOICE. Without the note, the Rams would've "found" the child missing the next morning and called the police. After performing a search on the house, the cops would've found the body, then what? That would've been it for the Rams. The note was the only indication of an outsider and since neither of them had an alibi at the time of the crime, they NEEDED that note.

    Anyway you slice it, it always leads back to J and PR.
     
  2. Cherokee

    Cherokee FFJ Senior Member

    Welcome to FFJ, PS! Excellent analysis for why there WAS no intruder ... only the Ramseys trying to explain JonBenet's dead body.

    As BobC and many of us here have said, intruders don't stage crime scenes in other people's homes, but people DO stage crime scenes in their own homes hoping to divert attention away from themselves.
     
  3. The Punisher

    The Punisher Member

    "As BobC and many of us here have said, intruders don't stage crime scenes in other people's homes, but people DO stage crime scenes in their own homes hoping to divert attention away from themselves."

    And how did he molest her before the killing?
     
  4. Some people might argue that he tied her up before the assault BUT what then could she have possibly done to make him "lose his temper" and kill her?

    She would've been totally quiet and helpless and thus, there wouldn't have been a catalyst to the apparent fit of rage... doesn't fit.

    One would also have to back that up by saying that the original crime scene was the basement... but was it?

    Seems more likely (and this is just my personal opinion) that the original crime scene was the kitchen. This is where the bowl of pineapple was and this is where the pad and pen was. Also, kitchen surfaces are easier to wipe clean than a wood, carpet or cement floor but what do i know.
     
  5. Show Me

    Show Me FFJ Senior Member

    Exactly Ploppy Slopper....the only reasonable explanation for the whole convoluted kidnapping/sexcrime cover up is to protect those inside the house from getting caught.

    Welcome to the forum.
     
  6. The Punisher

    The Punisher Member

    No, I meant that she had been molested before that night, PS!
     
  7. Ah! Forgive me, I misunderstood!

    I suppose it is possible that she could've been molested before the murder, but somehow i hardly think John Karr was the one responsible (wild guess).

    In any case, she was assaulted that night because of the bits of wood that were apparently found... down there.
    The pieces of wood were already identified as coming from Patsy's paintbrush, so something definitely happened at the time of the murder because she wouldn't have been walking around with bits of wood in there all day if it had happened earlier.

    The previous "abrasions" could've been some sort of infection or just an irritation, who knows.

    My gut feeling is that she had no history of sexual abuse. I just don't think the Rams were into that.
     
  8. The Punisher

    The Punisher Member

    "I suppose it is possible that she could've been molested before the murder, but somehow i hardly think John Karr was the one responsible (wild guess)."

    Yeah, just a hunch!

    "The pieces of wood were already identified as coming from Patsy's paintbrush, so something definitely happened at the time of the murder because she wouldn't have been walking around with bits of wood in there all day if it had happened earlier."

    They were microscopic, actually. David Jones thought they might be a WEEk old!

    "My gut feeling is that she had no history of sexual abuse. I just don't think the Rams were into that."

    Well, a lot of them thought it was physical punishment, not for gratification.
     
  9. Punishment eh? sounds a bit odd, but we are dealing with a pretty peculiar family. I don't know, PR always seemed like the type who'd give her kids a good shake or take a swing at them if they made her lose it... the whole paintbrush thing seems a little too creative for punishment.
     
  10. The Punisher

    The Punisher Member

    PS, the paintbrush itself was said to be part of the staging, not necessarily part of the punishment.
     
  11. Barbara

    Barbara FFJ Senior Member


    A reminder to LE if they are reading:

    STRANGERS/INTRUDERS HAVE NO NEED TO STAGE A CRIME SCENE

    psst Punisher...left you a little message in the Focus on Patsy thread....:)
     
  12. The Punisher

    The Punisher Member

    No need to stage it to look like an intruder!

    Barbara, I think I missed it! I'll go back!
     
  13. Correct, what I'm trying to say is: was the paintbrush used earlier as a form of punishment or used solely at the time of the murder for staging? It seems a little coincidental that the SAME paintbrush would've been used previously for punishment and then fetched again for the purpose of staging... seems more logical to assume that the whole "abuse" thing with the paintbrush happened at the same time as the crime, not earlier.
     
  14. The Punisher

    The Punisher Member

    "was the paintbrush used earlier as a form of punishment or used solely at the time of the murder for staging?"

    I agree with you: it was the staging. The earlier injuries were likely caused by fingers or rough wiping.
     
  15. Ginja

    Ginja Member

    I totally agree. That is, the paintbrush was staging re its use in the garrotte, which, btw, was totally useless as it hung off one end of the ligature. Garrottes have two handles so the perp can get a good hold on the ligature and pull tight.

    I believe the paintsbrush was inserted into JBR partly as staging to make it look like a sex crime, but also to help get rid of any evidence of prior molestation -- the real reason for the staging to begin with.

    It's driving me nuts that everyone agrees the crimescene was staged to look like an intruder came in. So why is it the BDA INSISTS on following up on staged evidence? Who's really focusing on the wrong leads?
     
  16. Excellent point about the garrote.

    This is a quote of mine from a post in Greenleaf's corner:

    "The paintbrush tells me a different story... someone used it to fake penetration because they didn't want to touch her themselves. The killer could've used his/her fingers but he/she chooses not to. Makes me think the killer didn't even want to touch her inappropriately, but did want to fake a rape or molestation. It was just another layer of deception."

    I agree. I've always liked whodunnits, but this one isn't even a good whodunnit because the answer is soooo obvious. The BDA is either a complete moron or (and this is far more frightening) is chasing the boogieman knowing he's an innocent boogieman.
     
  17. Ginja

    Ginja Member

    the garrotte

    Going back to garrotte, I always found it puzzling how certain people (and we know which idiots they are!) maintain that this was a gruesome murder done by a crazed pedophile, using the "garrotte" as proof, because not only is it a gruesome way to kill, but also perverts get into bondage and whatnot, and here we have a perfect 'setup' of bondage with tying her her up, covering her mouth, and garotting her to death.

    Good grief!

    That's what you get when you rely on following leads left in a staged crimescene.

    The BDA and RST should have paid attention when they watched The Godfather, for crying out loud. What was found around JonBenet's neck was not a garotte. What it was was a stick tied to one end of the ligature and as such, is totally useless for the intended purpose.

    IOW, someone staging the crimescene also staged the garotte to make it look like a pervert into bondage had done this.

    Now if a pervert into bondage had committed this crime:

    (1) The "garotte" would have had sticks on both ends of the ligature;

    (2) The wrist ligatures would have been tighter than the loose cord that could fall off her wrist easily without even having to untie them;

    (3) The duct tape would have been wrapped completely around her head not only to keep it on her, but to prohibit her from screaming out. The evidence proves the tape was put on JBR's mouth after she was unconcious. Try putting a 2" piece of duct tape on your mouth and trying to open it or scream....you'll be able to easily.

    These are all examples of staged evidence made to look like something it wasn't. Unfortunately, the BDA's office knows as little about these clues as the person who staged them. The person had the idea of making it look like something else but failed miserably as I've pointed out.
     
  18. The Punisher

    The Punisher Member

    "I believe the paintsbrush was inserted into JBR partly as staging to make it look like a sex crime, but also to help get rid of any evidence of prior molestation -- the real reason for the staging to begin with."

    Absolutely.

    "Now if a pervert into bondage had committed this crime:

    (1) The "garotte" would have had sticks on both ends of the ligature;

    (2) The wrist ligatures would have been tighter than the loose cord that could fall off her wrist easily without even having to untie them;

    (3) The duct tape would have been wrapped completely around her head not only to keep it on her, but to prohibit her from screaming out. The evidence proves the tape was put on JBR's mouth after she was unconcious. Try putting a 2" piece of duct tape on your mouth and trying to open it or scream....you'll be able to easily."

    Right again.
     
  19. Elle

    Elle Member

    I agree with Cherokee on your analysis of "no intruder." Excellent!

    Just wish you had chosen a different hat than Ploppy_Slopper. :-( guess I'll be calling you PS. I know! None of my business!
     
  20. JustChillun

    JustChillun Member

    The vaginal mucosa findings on autopsy are consistent with vaginal trauma at various stages of healing. Rough wiping will not penetrate or cause such a traumatic wound, and the wiping of a 6 year old is usually done by the 6 year old who wouldn't hurt themselves by doing so in such a sensitive area of the anatomy. If the wood had been habitually used and was deposited within the mucosa hours before death there would be redness and swelling associated with the bacterial introduction to the lower layers of tissue and from the immune response to a foreign substance (the wood).
     
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