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  1. #145
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    Default Disgrace

    Toth posted this:-

    (Note: I believe the allegations are that SX, friend of Helgoth, actually fired a pistol frequently, but it was at that location and was probably a hobby held in common).
    http://www.webbsleuths.org/dcforum/DCForumID37/351.html


    Where is he getting this information from? It certainly isn't the Tracey documentary. According to Tracey, Helgoth was the one who liked firing the pistols. There was NOTHING about Mr X firing pistols -nothing at all.

    Only a few days ago, Toth was over at CN2000 claiming that the hairs found on JonBenet were being specifically described as being from a "wolf-dog hybrid" .

    http://www.crimenews2000.com/cgi-bin...=5&part=8&vc=1

    When asked for his sources, he replied mysteriously that

    Tracey, Gray and Armistead are all men who leave the identification of a hair as being dog, wolf or dog-wolf-hybrid to the expert scientists.
    He declined to comment further despite requests from other posters to provide sources for his claims.

    This is an appalling spread of misinformation. There has been no official comment about the animal hairs other than the fact they exist. Tracey's doc claimed they matched the colour of Gigax's multi-coloured dogs "exactly" (IMO you would be hard pushed to find a hair colour that didn't exist on those dogs!). When I looked at jameson's forum there was a thread about wolf-dogs. Someone posted a news article about a woman who had looked after 4 stray wolf-hybrid pups and the thread proceeded to discuss the characteristics of such dogs. Did this somehow morph into a case "FACT" in Toth's head?

    jameson claims to forbid misinformation so why doesn't she put a lid on Toth? His repeated posting of unsupported claims is a disgrace.
    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  2. #146
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    Default This is for Margoo

    Margoo is getting confused about some details in Helgoth's autopsy report. Margoo has a "copy" of Trcey's documentary which shows a photo of the suicide scene. I suggest she looks at that to clear up some of her confusion.

    According to jameson, the autopsy report says:-

    Extremities - unremarkable - other than some bloody material on left palm there is, "no significant blood spattering noted."
    In reading this, Margoo commented:-

    It was his LEFT hand that had the blood on it and his right (dominant) hand had none.
    http://www.webbsleuths.org/dcforum/DCForumID37/356.html

    This image is from the suicide photo. This is Helgoth's RIGHT hand - it is clearly heavily bloodstained. The image isn't as clear as it appears on the TV BTW. They always lose quality when I upload them to Delphi.

    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  3. #147
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jayelles
    This image is from the suicide photo. This is Helgoth's RIGHT hand - it is clearly heavily bloodstained. The image isn't as clear as it appears on the TV BTW. They always lose quality when I upload them to Delphi.
    No, in this case, Margoo has it right. The photo which appeared in the National Enquirer was quite clear that Helgoth's right hand was, at least in the palm area, unstained by blood.



    But look at that box by his hand. That is the famous unheard tape. It could not contain a confession, because it is clearly unopened, still in its glossy shrinkwrap. You can even see the white area of the bar code, such as appears on the back of this unopened 8mm tape of mine:


  4. #148
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    Default

    These two photographs are not the same. In the photograph posted by Jayelles, his right hand is lying on top of what looks like a sheet of paper, with electrical cord going under his arm on the left, but you can't see it continuing on the right side because it's the same colour as the paper.

    In the photo posted by whynut, there is no paper present at all and you can see the electrical cord going under his arm and continuing to the end of the photograph. No paper! (?).

    I am assuming it is electrical cord, of course (?).
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  5. #149

    Default

    I believe that IS the same photograph.

    Jayelles photo isn't a great one, but I can see the cord in the same place in both pictures. I can see the cord continuing under the right side of his hand and it's not paper that it's running on. The shading of the carpet is lighter in that picture on the right side of his hand.

    I see the same piece of paper in the picture that Why-Nut posted. It's plain as day right underneath the SETTE.

  6. #150
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    Default My Photo

    My photo is poor quality Elle. It lost quality when I resized it and it lost more quality when I uploaded it onto Delphi. Also, remember that MY photo is a screen capture from tv and that even then, the tv camera was filming a picture on a computer!. Why_Nut's photo shows very clearly that his hand was clean. and it appears to be taken from a different angle so I guess the dark area in Tracey's photo is shadow. If you look at my screen capture, the tape which shows clearly in WN's photo is just a black blob in mine.

    I therefore hold my hand up and apologise to Margoo. I WAS WRONG! I have no problem in acknowledging when I am wrong and apologising to others. I'm big enough to do that. I can't same the same for others.

    However, I WILL say that on the documentary, the colour of this shadow is actually red. As soon as I saw it, I instantly "registered" that there was blood on that hand and I posted it at WS weeks ago. In the photo his face has blood stains on it too - described by the PIs in the doc as having been transferred there by his hand. I fuzzed out Helgoth's face when I posted the image, but looking at the original, blood transfer by hand is a plausible theory to me. You can't see inside his left hand in my photo.
    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  7. #151
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    Default Why_Nut

    That's a video tape you've posted a picture of. I thought it was an audio tape that went missing?

    EDITED TO SAY - sorry, I now realise that you posted the video tape to show the bar code on shrink wrap and that you weren't suggesting that this was the same kind of tape as in the photo.
    This is my opinion and it may not be copied in whole or in part without my written permission

  8. #152

    Default

    Jameson has put up Helgoth's autopsy-- well part of it anyway.

    Some of her posters in typical swamp fashion profess to know more than the medical examiner.

    I showed what was posted to two professionals. Not housewives who think they are detectives or doctors.

    Since I am neither a pathologist or even in the medical field, I prefer not to make an amateur analysis. Besides, there are professionals who are educated in this field and do this every day.

    Both said that the autopsy is indicitive of a suicide.

    And as far as the trajectory going left to right:

    People who shoot themselves in the chest often hold the pistol with the grip against the palm and the thumb on the trigger. That grip produces the described track.

    Is this something else the "renowned" detectives don't know-- just like they didn't know how to use "Google" or "Search Systems"?

    Another thing, the pillow-- if it happened as described in the crock should have been mentioned in the autopsy. Maybe it was, because it appears the autopsy was edited. However, since the crock was inaccurate in other areas, we really do not know what was true.

    I am appalled that Michael Helgoth's crime scene photos were on public display in this documentary and I wonder who gave permission to release them. Who sold them to the tabs to be featured in stories that imply he was involved in the murder? Only the next of kin, the police and D.A. have access to them...

  9. #153
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    Default Jayelles

    Jayelles,

    Things like this happen to all of us. For starters it does look like blood on his hand in that photo you posted, and of course with the line running through it, it seemed like the edge of paper or whatever because it was very light, but don't despair. You do a tremendous job. There are many faulty photos out there relating to this case, and I haven't seen too many posters saying they were "sorry!"
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.

  10. #154
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    Default Toth

    Jayelles wrote: Where is he getting this information from? It certainly isn't the Tracey documentary. According to Tracey, Helgoth was the one who liked firing the pistols. There was NOTHING about Mr X firing pistols -nothing at all.
    Are you talking about Patsy Toth? Knows all, hears all and says all about the Ramseys? Corrects you if Patsy was somewhere else at the time. Knows everything Patsy does? My guess (?). She's Patsy's clone. What's yours Jayelles?
    elle: The RST can't handle the truth!
    Just my opinion.



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