Burke Ramsey... the missing link

I love this book.

Over half of the animals slaughtered for food in America are processed using Dr. Grandin's humane methods. It should be 100%.

 

Wombat, my dear friend, you do NOT have Asperger's. You would not be on THIS BOARD if you had Asperger's. FFJ requires much more social interaction and spectrum of thought than those with Asperger's can manage.

Asperger's Syndrome is not another word for "geek" or "nerd" or "engineer." Ask Jayelles. She has taught children with Asperger's. There is a definite difference. No one is saying that people with Asperger's are "disabled," but they do need special ways of helping them learn and function in society.

Of course, there are varying degrees of Asperger's, and a person with only a slight condition might not need any help in decoding social cues or finding ways to approach new subjects. One of Jay's students was totally obsessed with Lord of the Rings ... to the point of being able to think of nothing else. Everything in his life related to Lord of the Rings. He simply could not concentrate on anything UNRELATED to Lord of the Rings. So, Jay altered her teaching materials just for him, and incorporated Lord of the Rings into some of his work. It helped the young man be able to relate to the subject in a way that he could not have done otherwise. And that's just one example. I'm sure Jay could explain it better than I.

My husband is an engineer, and he told me the following joke:

How can you tell if you're talking to a geologist? He looks at your shoes when you're talking to him.

How can you tell if you're talking to an engineer? He looks at his OWN shoes when you're talking to him.

But my husband, and all the other engineers I've known, do not have Asperger's. They may not be social gadflies, but they do have social skills. They may love math and using it to understand the world around them, but that's not an "obsession" to the point of exclusion. They also have other interests.

Having an "engineer personality" does not mean you have Asperger's. Having Asperger's does not mean you're disabled. And the possiblity that Burke MIGHT have Asperger's was not a slam on him, but just some poster's attempt to understand his personality and behavior.

By the way, I think I might have "Tennyson's Syndrome." Is it fatal?

 

Thank you for your consideration, but I am not responding to someone who call my thoughts defensive and bizarre.

This is exactly what I meant. I apologize for not being clear!

 

Thank you for clarifying things so well, Cherokee! I don't know where along the line people started to think that Asperger's/Autism encompasses engineers and computer nerds! They are different things entirely. Maybe it's because the numbers of people diagnosed seem to be going up. The perception is that people are being falsely diagnosed. That may also be true, but people with autism, wherever they are on the spectrum, are not merely engineer-types.

Heymom

 

OK, I guess this is where I get to jump back in. I have a son with Asperger's Syndrome, he is now 11 years old. This is definitely not just a "personality type." As Jayelles and others have stated, it is marked by some specific characteristics, the most prominent being, IMO, the inability to read social cues accurately, or in some cases, at all.

My son's autistic-type behaviors were identifiable at age 3, and were quite pronounced. He was definitely not a typical preschooler. We finally got the correct diagnosis at age 5. In the early years, I was hopeful that with lots of therapies he would eventually progress right out of the diagnosis and seem pretty neurotypical, but as he has gotten older, particularly now that he is entering puberty, I don't see that happening. The social difficulties have just gotten more pronounced, and he has a very difficult time managing his obsessions. I am very hopeful that he will be able to attend college, but I don't see him being able to go away to a major university at age 19 and be able to maintain a schedule and take care of himself. Maybe he can by the time he's 25 or so, but these kids are late bloomers and are socially several years behind their peers. I anticipate him taking a light schedule and living at home for at least the first few years of college. Transitions are difficult, and I just can't imagine that if Burke has AS, that he can make such a major transition so easily, especially since his mother just passed away.

Also, in my experience, it is very difficult for AS people to lie. They can be lied to fairly easily, as they are naive and gullible. But if Burke was a witness or had first-hand knowledge of what happened that night, I have a hard time believing that he would be able to contain that information, especially right after it happened. AS people are real sticklers for precise language and have no tolerance for exaggeration or word substitution! And I would think that J & P would have been absolutely panicked that he might blurt it out to someone at any time, and they would never have allowed him to be out of their sight.

 

Dear Cherokee:

"And the possiblity that Burke MIGHT have Asperger's was not a slam on him, but just some poster's attempt to understand his personality and behavior."

--Exactly right. And also an attempt to defend BR against those who might attempt to attach a more sinister "interpretation" to the (then) child's behavior.

 

Dear Masker:

"And I would think that J & P would have been absolutely panicked that he might blurt it out to someone at any time, and they would never have allowed him to be out of their sight."

--And that, Masker, is one excellent and perceptive insight on your part.

 

No, not an attempt to defend Burke Ramsey, at least not on my part. I don't know how things happened that night in the Ramsey home. I am not a BDI believer. I just have a problem believing that a child, any child, could be completely silent about something like this for 10 years, if he knew anything or if he did something sinister. Especially if he has some signs of Asperger's Syndrome. People with AS are usually frank to a fault, and will say things that you and I wouldn't not say, out of politeness or social rules they don't understand.

I think there are various people here who believe that Burke was somehow involved. I am not one of them.

Heymom

 

You're right Daniel, it would have been ridiculous, and it never happened.

I believe the only effort the Ramseys made to find out what could possibly happen to Burke was to open the dictionary and look up the word "incest".

Since the dictionary was found open and the page dog-eared to that word, I think it had to be related to Burke. I don't see John or Patsy saying to themselves, "Gee, am I guilty of incest? - I better look it up!"

 

maybe

Maybe Burke heard that word used and by adult Ramseys and looked it up.

 

Maybe he was trying to get a message across without saying anything out loud.

Heymom

 

In my opinion, Burke was the reason why John helped Patsy in the cover-up. But not because Burke had anything to do with the crime. I think it was done to spare Burke the horrible experience of having his mother exposed in public as the person who had killed his little sister in a rage.
I can imagine that hadn't there Burke been left to care for, Patsy would have committed suicide after realizing what she had done to JonBenet.

 

But, rashomon, wouldn't John Ramsey have been worried about what Patsy might possibly do to Burke in a rage? I would think he wouldn't have wanted Patsy anywhere near her surviving child.

 

I didnt think JR could see much past himself to worry over any of his kids..

th eold adage ..keep your friends close..and your enemies even closer.. a child who knows 'too much' isnt in the friends category I should suppose !!

 

Originally posted by Carol:

Same here, Carol. If John thought that Patsy killed JonBenet, why did he allow her to take Burke to Michigan shortly after the murder? Why wasn't John afraid Patsy would snap and harm Burke?

 

for mine the reason John might alow Patsy to do anything..is quite simply teh half veiled threat contained in the ransom note....as we say...she had the wood over him !! he now had a slightly ( sic ) on the edge nutso wife..who really didnt have much to lose if caught..and he would also go down big time.. neither wanted to be caught..so he played along with the charade..

and I dont hink he really cared that much...didnt seem to care much about his lil girl...why is he going to worry over the boy !!

 

I think Patsy's relationship with Jon Benet was much different than her relationship with Burke - more volatile. In many ways, Patsy was living through JB, but also saw JB as a small version of herself. She may also have seen JB as a rival for John's attention/ affections. I do not think that Burke would ever have been in danger of harsh action from Patsy. She loved Burke, but she didn't live through him or see him as a mini version of herself.

In addition, I personally believe that Patsy's actions toward JB were more the result of other factors that happened that night, and not because Patsy is the kind of mother who harms her children on a routine, or even when angered, basis.

 

Question

Were there twin beds in Burke's room like there were in jbr's? The photo of his room at ACR's only shows one bed, and it doesn't look like the bed has been slept in.

 

My grandson was a "geek" when he was 9 and still is. He played computer games the same as Burke did. He now builds his own computers and revises software for the games he plays (probably illegal). It was written in some JBR book that Burke talked about computer games when he was being questioned about JBR. Anyway, my guess is my grandson would have acted exactly like Burke did.

This does not change my feelings that Burke did not sleep thru whatever went on, and belief that he was on the tape. I also believe he told Fleet White something that has influenced his actions all these years.

 

Shadow

"This does not change my feelings that Burke did not sleep thru whatever went on, and belief that he was on the tape. I also believe he told Fleet White something that has influenced his actions all these years."

I agree with every word