JB's grave revisited; weird stuff there...

I just read about that last night. The Ramseys are Christian so I didn't think much of it. Altho that doesn't always mean anything, we do take customs from other religions if it suits our fancy.

 

Elle--right you are!

It's Melinda. I keep forgetting the names of the minor players.

 

Me too! I need a little black book!

 

Thank you River Rat this was a good suggestion. It was good that Greenleaf managed to go there in spite of the long journey, and circumstances.

 

Hahahahaha! The mice were driving the cats nuts, and an umbrella inside out??? You must be in a wee toty village Jay. Back in the late 70's we were back in Scotland on an assignment - large legs for an oil rig in the North Sea - and we stayed in a wee hilly village. It was July, and we were wearing our winter jackets at the coast, and it rained. Oh boy did it rain! I was huffing and puffing up a hill to go to the stores, and a wee wifey much older than me at that time, passed me by, and with a smile holding on to her umbrella, she said, "It's an awfy day, an awfy day!" She had more energy in her than I had,Jay. Methinks I'm the same age as that wee wifey now. Those small villages are beautiful, and everyone knows what's going on.

 

Yes - I was also thinking that this makes Greenie's effort all the more special. I really do think that plant is lovely.

I have mixed feelings about the angels. I can see how many might think them tacky - but they are a symbol of caring from a whole bunch of people and caring isn't tacky. Their worth should probably be measured by the gesture. What I hate to see on graves are soft toys. They are so quickly destroyed by the weather and then they just look so sad.

We have no family graves. Everyone has been cremated and their ashes scattered. We don't even believe in placing memorials in the local papers on the anniversaries of a death. We remember our loved ones at family dinners and often in conversations.

Burials are less common here than cremations. Catholics tend to be buried but Scotland is a Protestant country.

 

I agree, Jayelles. Caring isn't tacky.

One of the mason's funerals I went to awhile back - he was known to fondle his daughter's friends. I guess men who do that are everywhere.

 

Wel the rescued cats were in cages you see and the mice were canny enough not to venture into the cages. The news station even went to the trouble of filming a reconstruction using a clockwork mouse. They set the mouse running past the cages and the cats went berserk. The rescue home owner's own cat got the blame. They explained that the previous resident cat had been a good mouser but that the current cat is too lazy and they showed the clockwork mouse shooting past the resident cat and she just lay and watched it. Very important news don't you think?

It never ceases to amaze me what makes news here - "Local butcher sold out of mince!" "Man locked out of house!"

Our cities would be considered villages in the States.

I did enjoy noe news item last night about an American guy - Gingren or something like that, who robbed banks and was reported by his family when they recognised him on cctv camera. That was extraordinary.

 

When I was little, there weren't any 'paedophiles' - just 'dirty old men' and there were plenty of them. My uncle was one. I hasten to add that he married into our family and wasn't a blood relative. When I was little, my mother used to act really funny when Uncle Bill came to the house and she was always hovering about when he started playing his games with the kids and would interrupt the game to ask us to do errands.

My father hated him and gave him a good beating once because of the way he treated my aunt.

 

I can't type for laughing, Jay. If you could make a comic strip out of these stories, they would be hilarious.

There are many mixed feelings about cremation, but they are running out of space in many places, and it seems to be the most sensible way to go, especially when many graves are not attended regularly. To each his own.

I'm happy your mother took care of the dirty old uncle. She must have known. Yes, dirty old men, is what they were called. If they put me in charge "castration" would be the order of the day. Here in Canada, before they release them, they publish the address of where the paedophiles will be staying, and all hell breaks loose, because parents don't want them within a short distance from their children. Crazy! "Castration is the only answer." Why can't they make this decision to preserve the lives of our children?

 

A while back in this thread there was some mention made of Jewish gravesite traditions, and as they were somewhat incorrect, and nobody has clarified them, I've de-lurked.

In the Jewish faith there is the tradition of placing a small pebble on the gravesite visited, even if you didn't know that person in life. The pebble shows that the person is remembered (and not neglected). This pebble has no other significance, it's usually just a pebble, stone, or tiny rock found on the cemetary walkways. (In our family we've got a tradition of bringing rocks from our travels to great-grandmother, who places them on the headstone of her husband, but that's just our way of showing that we remember him no matter where we are.)

None of the above. I can't say that some of these haven't been done, but they're in no way part of any mainstream Jewish tradition, whether reform, conservative, orthodox, Ashkenazi, Sephardi, or modern Israeli.

The pebbles are usually taken from the near-by walkway, not painted, and certainly not engraved (because the pebbles are swept from the graves at least once annually, setting the counters back to zero, so to speak). Pennies are never used. And I've never, ever, heard of some mystical requirement for having the pebble passed hand-to-hand.

Not that this has anything at all to do with JBR, but I didn't want the misinformation to stand. (Not that I'm an expert in Jewish minutae, but I'll certainly field and forward questions about these and other issues as I can. PM or email.)

 

Welcome Mickey. Thank you for your interesting post!

 

I posted information received from a friend, Mickey, and other information has also been posted. It is always good to receive the correct information. We learn something knew every day. Thank you.

Edited to add, this friend of mine confirmed that what he stated was his own true experience with his oldest Jewish friend, Mickey, so ... I will say no more!

Oops! I'm afraid I will say some more. This is Canada, not the U.S.A. I'm talking about Mickey! So ... one must allow for the difference.

 

Thanks for these pics, Greenleaf, and for your thoughts and kind gesture with the beautiful yew. It's lovely.

Unfortunately, it won't be there long, I'm afraid. I've been to the grave a few times, and I've left a token, but I once ran into the caretaker and he told me they take everything off the grave often.

There is a webpage memorial for JonBenet ACR put up a few years ago. It's lovely and has pics of the grave then. It's much the same, with a few changes: the arch is gone now, for example.

The last time I went I took pics, but I never put them online because it just seemed they were so similar, why bother? But now that you've posted and the discussion has turned to coins and cards left on the grave, maybe I should include the last ones I took on this thread as well. They're from the summer of 2004. The thing is, I remember coins on the gravestone then, as well.

Also, the caretaker told me that there was an aged man who came often and just sat at the grave on the bench for a little while. He told me other things, as well, but I'll skip that for now.

If you notice on ACR's website, there's a letter wrapped in plastic under the bench, if you look closely. It says something like "Please give this to your parents," I believe.

http://www.acandyrose.com/20021225anniversary.htm

There's a storm here now, so I'm going to shut down. I'll look for the pics I took of the grave that have the coins in them and see if I can get them put up here.

Again, thanks, Greenleaf, for your thoughtfulness. It was a sad place for me, too. IMO, no amount of grave-tending can erase the obscenity of a child's body lying in that grave, murdered 9 years ago.

 

OK, I found the pics and there is what looks like a dime on the ledge of the headstone, and there is a rock on the side of the stone, as well.

If anyone wants to see these, let me know. Moab said she'd put them up for me, but since no one has commented, I won't bother if there's no interest.

By the way, I wonder if the 4 cards of the twos of each suit might be meant to be interpreted as tarot cards would be. I'll see what I can figure out on that angle, but I'm not that good with tarot cards as I just do it for fun and games, so if anyone else is experienced in tarot or knows someone who is, maybe we can see what the person who put the cards there is saying. I think the retired surgeon from Purgatory did tarrot cards, didn't she? Or was that only astrology?

Well, just an idea.

 

I'd like to see, i didn't say anything cause I was patiently waiting like a good girl.

 

Me too!

I just can't wait to see Candy go nuts over KoldKase's.........of ALL People....pictures of the gravesite. Now that will be Instant Gratification!

RR

 

OK then! I'll get them to Moab. She works during the day, so it may take a little while.

(hehehe Poking a stick at gutter candy through the bars...now that's the best!)

 

KoldKase

Koldkase, who are you anyway?

Your posts have made me realize that my knowledge of the Ramsey case is minuscule, compared to the enormous wealth of information you harbor, regarding same. I confess that I am in awe of not only your knowledge of the case but of the depth and breadth of your intellectual prowess.

Your exchange with jams was mesmerizing! Point by point, you knock down her erroneous ramblings; and you do this, all the while, sticking to the factual aspects of the case. You managed to stay in the mode with great civility, while ever opining within the constraints of reason. Wow! Who are you anyway?

You inspired me to do something that I have resisted from the get go. And, that is to actually sit down and read Patsy Ramsey’s so called “interview.†What a crock! Lin Wood interrupts at every turn and what Patsy actually says could be put on the tip of a pen. And, all the while, she and John are stating publicly that they are “looking for the killer,†and are willing to “cooperate†with no hold bars "interviews."

Much of what you have written, KoldKase, has started to churn up me old gray matter, forcing me to look anew at this very ugly cast of characters; not the least of which are Patsy, John, Woody, Hunter and Jams.

I am an American and proud of it, but I am ashamed of a Judicial System that allows two murderers to thumb their noses at everything our Constitution holds sacred. It is a shame!

Lest me forget, a little girl, an abused and murdered little girl, is six feet under the cold clay soil of Georgia. She was put there by lust and arrogance, and will stay there, unavenged, through corruption, indifference and the promise of money and/or fame.

America wake up! THERE WAS NO INTRUDER! Jams and her ilk are delusional. Woody’s actions go way beyond the normal guidelines of a defense attorney. Yes, indeed, MONEY counts, and if you have enough of it you can by-pass laws that us ordinary citizens must obey. You can even MURDER and get away with it, if you have enough money. Yes, indeed. The Ram case epitomizes that truism.

I am convinced, now, more than ever, that the Justice Department should conduct an investigation into the Ram case. After all, it has ramifications that affect us all. Every single person, including attorneys, public officials, members of law enforcement, and just ordinary citizens, who participated in this crime and/or the cover-up, should be exposed and punished, to the fullest extent of the law.

It is ridiculous for this saga to continue on this path of lies, while aiding and abetting the (obvious) parties guilty of this heinous crime.

If we turn a blind eye to our smallest and most helpless citizens, we should turn in our citizenships. Justice should mean something, especially our American Judicial System; a system our forefathers fought and died for; a system we are still fighting and dying for.

I believe that, in the end, spiritual laws always win out. Man made laws may be far behind, but, sooner or later, they catch up. Oh, how I hope I live long enough to see the prep walk.

Forgive me for rambling. KoldKase, see what you have wrought?

All this is My Own Personal Opinion.

Greenleaf
:leaf:

 

You're kidding right? Don't you have a tin foil hat? KK is the chosen one by the Almight Szurtzun (sp). All great thoughts are channelled to us via KK and the sooperdooper tin foil hat. (I have a tin foil kilt - doesn't seem to be working too well....)

We are not worthy ....... :moose: