The Significance Of The Big Bloomies...

I've done a few little experiments but I always lay out my methods clearly so that anyone can replicate them. I would urge anyone to repeat the experiment.

Also - Bloomies knickers are a bit of a gimmick - kind of like souvenir knickers from Bloomingdales. The purpose of souvenirs is to advertise the store/town/country. They rarely come in different styles and varieties.

 

VP ... I would add that it has been reported that JonBenet often needed adult assistance when going to the bathroom. That suggests that the Ramseys may have been concerned that SOMEONE at the White party may have witnessed that she was wearing the Wednesday Bloomies (size 6), and the Ramsey needed to match the Wednesday (Monday would cripple their story) and HOPE that the pantie size wouldn't be noticed.


...YumYum

 

To me, the huge Bloomies is just another mystery. Had Patsy claimed ignorance, I would have notched it up to evidence for an intruder. I simply cannot explain why Patsy would decide to use these massive knickers on a 6 year old - especially when she was so fussy about style and show.

I consider it one of the odd things about the case but then again - I do some pretty odd things myself

 

I think the size 12 bloomies might have something to do with bedwetting, but only in the sense that they would have fit over pull-up diapers.

If the size 12 bloomies weren't put on her during the staging (probably by John, who may not have paid attention to how poorly they fit JonBenet), I think it's possible JonBenet got ready for bed Christmas night and put on pull-ups, and then put the big bloomies on over the pull-ups - which were then removed at the time of the molestation. (I don't believe the vaginal abrasions were part of the staging.)

JonBenet's pink pajama top was found folded under her pillow, which suggests she didn't sleep in her bed Christmas night. Since she apparently slept in Burke's room on Christmas Eve, the urine stain on her bed sheet may have been from the night of Dec. 23, or it might have been older. Even though Linda Hoffman-Pugh changed the sheets on the 23rd, the clean sheets she put on the bed may have contained traces of urine, because washing sheets doesn't always completely remove urine and other substances.

 

Your tone is so rude and condescending. I don’t need to go look at the sizes in the store and fondle panties to see the difference. There is obviously one. But my point is the ones chosen for the experiment were high legged versus a full-legged brief. A regular panty would fit with a thick diaper. I’m sorry I just don’t automatically believe the experiment is the end all truth. Just as I don’t accept Patsy’s claims she bought the diapers for the cruise, or her claims she frequently wore her clothing two days in a row, or Burke was not around during the 911 call. For the most part anything that came out of her mouth I find negotiable.

 

Have you looked at the photo of the briefs?

 

All we can do is lead you to the water, Mlazy ... you have to do the drinking yourself. Obviously, you are unwilling to accept the finding of others, and refuse to do a very, VERY simple experiment to inform yourself. There's clearly nothing that I can do for you. You have to want to help yourself ... and as you have stated, you are UNWILLING to do so.

Sad.


...YumYum

 

Obviously hasnt looked at the photo of the two sizes side by side. Or doesnt recognise full briefs....

 

Wow.... whats with all the hostility in here?

I believe Jayelles experiment is perfectly accurate but i respect MlazyV's right to disagree.

Not all of us newbs are experts on the case, i myself was too young at the time of the murder to be concerned with it. Its been years now, and there are a lot of young, fresh eyes, taking a first look at this case. I ask all the "veterans" in here to just be patient. If you really don't want new people in here with a fresh perspective, you shouldn't allow them to register. Just my opinion.

:newbie:

 

That's OK PS. I just resent the insinuation that I fiddled the experiment by using high legged knickers when in fact, I conducted and documented the entire experiment with the utmost integrity.

No sweat, most people will see that the knickers were not the high legged variety. One only needs to look at the length of the side seams to see that!

 

I understand, but you know some people are naturally more skeptical than others.

Quite correct. The side seam does make it pretty evident.

 

You are right, Ploppy ... I was unnecessarily gruff to Mlazy. But the fact remains that she refuses to accept others' finding, yet is too mLazy to do some very, VERY simple research for herself. It's as if she wants to believe what she wants to believe, and doesn't even want to hear about evidence to the contrary.

Nonetheless ... I apologize for my rudeness, Mlazy. But you owe it to yourself to answer your own questions with a simple trip to a childrens clothing store. It's just that simple. In fact, I'm going to go do that experiment for myself. I'll give ya my findings when I get back. And I'm not going JUST to fondle bloomies!

Later ...


...YumYum

 

That's very brave of you. You're not near Bloomingdales are you?

 

LOL - Actually, thinking about it, if they were high legged knickers, with the length of that side seam, the waistband would end up half way up the torso - NOT cool

 

"too mlazy".... sorry mlazyv but i just had to laugh... hilarious!

Hehe... easy on the fondling there slick :winko:

 

Mlazy, you came on a bit strong yourself, but no worry. A lot of us have been around a long time, and we do get a bit callous at times.

Of course, believe what you believe, and make up your own mind. I doubt that any two people here have the same exact theory. I also don't think anyone here cares about that.

But Jayelles went to a lot of trouble to do this experiment. Perhaps you don't know that the first pair of Bloomies she bought for her own child in New York were purchased a year or two ago. The larger pair she purchased on a trip this year, I believe. Her child just reached six years of age, very close in size to JonBenet, so Jayelles used her to determine the differences. I don't think Jayelles set out to come to a specific conclusion. When she saw the difference on her child, she wanted to demonstrate it to us, and making a rudimentary model was her solution. She took her own time and money and creative skill to present this to us.

I for one find it a very illustrative and valuable experiment, in light of Patsy's own claims when LE interviewed her. And I thank Jayelles for caring enough to take the time and initiative to do this for us. No one has ever done this experiment before. That's why YumYum suggested you might want to do it for yourself. We all could.

Yum Yum is infamous for his "style." He pulls no punches. But he's harmless. If youi get to know him, you'll still be shocked by him sometimes. But he cares a great deal and adds so much to the forums he's been posting on for many years. All us oldies love him.

Whether you think Jayelles' experiment is worth even looking at, no matter. Welcome to the forum. I hope you find some things worthwhile at any rate.

 

My Take On the Bloomies, Ploppy

Ploppy, I've always felt that Jonbenet's fate that night had a lot to do with her enuresis problem & we know this is something that Patsy and John tried often to deny or downplay ....

Sooo ... we know from Linda HP (house cleaner) that Jonbenet was still frequently soiling the bed & Patsy made it a point to wash the bed sheets before Linda would arrive for duty. I'm confident that was because Patsy was in some sort of denial (and/or shame) as to Jonbenet's enuresis - it just didn't fit with her image of a future beauty queen. Her impatience to have Jonbenet grow up (as witnessed in the many Vegas style costumes) bears this out. Many adults are filled with anxiety over enuresis, even at the lesser ages of say 2 or so.

In any event, here's my theory .... amidst all the stress of Xmas decorating (e,g. 7 xmas trees, etc), hosting, partying, extensive travel & an upcoming Haiwain Pageant to be held immediately upon their return from the Disney Boat Cruise (after their visit to Charlevoix) ... Patsy lost it somehow that night & the trigger was perhaps another "bedwetting incident" - it might have pushed her over the top, as she was trying desperately to get Jonbenet ready for the Tropical Pageant.

We know that the costume was laid out that night in JAR's room & we also know that Patsy did NOT want to go to Charlevoix.

In summary, the panties (Wednesday "small size") were perhaps pretty badly soiled & it's my feeling that Patsy or ??? maybe even JR had to put another pair of panties on - and they had to be Wednesday, in case any family member or friend, etc. (at the White's party, etc) recalled that Jonbenet wore Wednesday panties.

Jonbenet might have even bragged to Fleet White's daughter Dafney, that she had on her Wednesday bloomies. Who knows?

As well, LE noted that a box of pull-ups was askew & opened in the cupboard just outside Jonbenet's room (or something to that effect).

I've always felt the whole Jonbenet scene was about stress & Jonbenet's enuresis & someone, most likely Patsy lost it that night. It was perhaps the straw that broke the camel's back.

Oh well, just my 2 cents.

BTW, welcome to Justice Forum ..... you seem to be very level headed & very articulate.

Regards,
Mandarin

 

Great theory Mandarin, I really appreciate it.

And thanks for the welcome.

 

A Few Little More Tidbits

BTW, that's quite a costume you have on Plop Slop .... Sort or Harlequineske (sp?)

Here's something to add .... The appearance of Jonbenet was of the utmost importance to Patsy - When I heard (in their book & elsewhere) that Patsy ordered an exact replica of Jonbenet, i.e. The My Twin Doll, I found it bizarre.

Imagine someone giving you a life size doll of yourself as a gift and I don't care how old you are - it would be creepy & more especially so, to a child .... The irony is that in the Jonbenet case, the life sized doll did become the only replica anyone has of her at that age today.

I'm not sure, but I think Patsy still held onto it & might even have shown it on TV in on of the many Ramsey interviews.

Something else .... The My Twin Doll came in a very large box that was filled with those styrofoam peanuts from data I've read in the past.

Since it was such a large box (probably something obviously the size of a small child's coffin) I always wondered if Patsy and/or John tried to shove it through the basement window so that Jonbenet's big surprize Xmas present wouldn't be seen before Xmas day.

That's why, I feel, there were styrofoam peanuts strewn around the basement here & there - which the RST would like us to believe are yet another piece of the puzzle. They KNOW or must know about the packing the doll came in, so I just don't understand why they spin the bit about styrofoam pieces, etc. in the basement.

You know, when you think of all the stress Patsy was going through (turning 40, almost having to celebrate her actual birthday the 29th on the Disney Boat, leaving her magnificently (to her anyway) decorated Boulder home & hopping on a quick flight to welcome John's kids from his ex in Charlevoix .... she must have felt that she was being "Stressed By Travel Constraints"

You fill in the blanks ... e.g. SOILED BLOOMIES TRASH CAN, whatever!

Regards,
Mandarin

 

Ha! costume... I dress like that all the time! joking. :crosseyed

Yeah, the My Twin doll thing was always peculiar to me. That and having JB and PR wearing matching outfits... Patsy never did know the meaning of "age-appropriate".

There was clearly something wrong with the woman. She really seemed to have a warped notion of reality, especially the fact that her daughter was a small child with a separate identity, not a mini-Patsy.