The Dust Detective and the JBR case

Discussion in 'Justice for JonBenet Discussion - Public Forum' started by koldkase, Oct 17, 2010.

  1. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    Do y'all remember this little "evidence" item that came out when PERV Karr was the big news from Team Ramsey?

    We haven't discussed it all that much. But looking at the recent developments from the BPD, I thought it might be worth another look. I find it interesting for several reasons:

    1. This "dust" evidence taken from the crime scene sat in this lab for 10 YEARS?

    2. If there were evidence from these particles that indicated there was an intruder, we'd have heard all about it from Smit and Lacy, no doubt.

    3. This evidence is microscopic, yet nothing to point to that old intruder?

    Also, I found something else that makes it even more interesting to me, which I'll include next.


    Now look at how much work this forensic scientist actually did on this particle/dust evidence from this case--and we really haven't heard that much about it, have we:

    40 pages? Wonder what he found? He kept it until Lacy asked for it back, when she arrested PERV Karr. How long did he have it?


  2. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

  3. Elle

    Elle Member

    I'm ashamed to admit I haven't heard about this wonderful Forensic scientist Skip Palenik, until right this very minute KK. There were times when I felt I was finished posting on the JonBenét case and then I was drawn back for one reason or another. Thank you for posting this valuable history of Palenik's work. Much appreciated. I will read the Popular Science article tomorrow.
  4. Learnin

    Learnin Member

    Well, for starters, he no doubt analyzed the dust and lint that was found on JBR's feet. If this is the case, then, LE should know where JBR was standing at some point just before being struck, no?

    Would there have been samples taken from various other places on her body and clothing? Where would you begin?

    This would be similar to looking for touch DNA, no?

    Did they scrape for dust off of the ligature to see if any special "outside the home" evidence was there?
  5. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    Questions to ponder....

    How I wish we knew the answers.
  6. Learnin

    Learnin Member

    Makes you wonder if ST knew the dust and lint was from her bathroom, thus, his theory of a bed wetting incident. Maybe I place too much emphasis on that dust and lint but I can't help but think this would let LE know the last place JBR was standing before being killed.
  7. Learnin

    Learnin Member

    You mentioned 40 pages in a previous post. I read through the links you provided and they are very interesting. But, I couldn't find any information in regards to his work on the JBR case. Did he present a 40 page report on the case?
  8. koldkase

    koldkase FFJ Senior Member

    Go back to my first post; in it are two quoted sections of articles. The second one has two parts I put in bold. The second one has the only info I've ever seen about the 40 page report. I have no idea what is in it.

    I'd like to know what was on her feet, as well. How about mold from that cellar room? How about carpet fibers from the basement? That kind of thing.
  9. Learnin

    Learnin Member

    Okay, thanks, KK, I read the part about his 40 page report. A FORTY PAGE REPORT ON THE DUST... There must have been some significant information in a 40 page report!!! I guess there's something else I could add to the WHAT ARE YOU MOST SURE ABOUT THREAD:

    I'm 100% sure they know where JBR last stood.
  10. Learnin

    Learnin Member

    Fellow posters, I'm bumping this thread since Kolar's book has since come out and since we now know the GJ voted to indict. I want to provide a quote about the Dust Doctor that I think is extremely relevant:

    Palenik has been vacuuming dust for 50 years. As a child, he spent hours emptying the family vacuum cleaner and analyzing its contents. He used a microscope to trace the origins of the debris: Did it come from the kitchen or bathroom? Did it belong to his mother or father? He didn’t know it then, but he was following a theory called Locard’s Exchange Principle. It’s the primary tenet known to every scientist in the forensic field: any contact leaves a trace. Or, as Palenik explains it: “Whenever two objects come into contact, there is always a transfer of material.â€

    I have always been attracted to that statement, included in ST's book, where he states the coroner noticed dust and lint on JBR's feet when he entered the house and first viewed the body.

    Since Kolar has written the book, and is discussing the case, I propose that, if Tricia or anyone is able to interview him again, that Kolar be questioned about this Dust Doctor's report and about the dust that was on JBR's feet.
    Please note the bolded statement about the Dust Doctor. Evidently, he is able to determine whether dust comes from the kitchen or bathroom, etc.

    Lastly. How much lint and dust was on JBR's feet. If there was considerable lint and dust on the soles of JBR's feet, this tells me that the longjohns were not removed or put on JBR after she sustained the head wound. Tight leggings, being pulled off the feet, would pull off all that dust and lint or the vast majority of it.

    This lint and dust question, IMO, is of crucial importance and I'm sure that Kolar must have read the Dust Doctor's report.
  11. Elle

    Elle Member

    What an interesting and terrific post Learnin. Let's hope it will be acknowledged and Chief Kolar can provide the answer. I'm always learning something new when I read about this case. Thank you for bumping this thread. I will read through the posts!
  12. Elle

    Elle Member

    So pleased I responded here in 2010, KK. I'll do my best to go through it again.

    Thanks for your excellent contributions here!
  13. heymom

    heymom Member

    Gosh, he must have been a very strange child. :sleuth::crosseyed I mean, I'm glad for his expertise and all, but can you imagine what his parents must have been thinking??
  14. Learnin

    Learnin Member

    I would imagine the microscope came first and then the need to have something to examine. I remember getting my first microscope. My cousin and I used to hunt for things to examine. But, yea, vacuuming and emptying the bag, well, that's taking it a whole step further.
  15. Elle

    Elle Member

    Yes,hm, if this had been one of my sons emptying the vacuum cleaner and browsing through the dust when they were very young, I would have been very concerned. Hope it wasn't on the dining room table (?) :)
  16. heymom

    heymom Member

    My younger son had his scope while we were building our swimming pool. The rain water that collected at the bottom before it was completed yielded some interesting views...not as nasty as we imagined it would be, however.
  17. heymom

    heymom Member

    I'm a pretty relaxed housekeeper, and very into science and learning, but I think even I would have had to intervene in that process. If his mom allowed him to carry this out inside the house, the woman is a saint.
  18. zoomama

    zoomama Active Member

    But...but IF he was the one who actually did the vacuuming that wouldn't be all bad would it? LOL
  19. BobC

    BobC Poster of the EON - Fabulous Inimitable Transcript

    i'm a relaxed house-cleaner too. In fact, sometimes I lapse into a coma.
  20. DeeDee

    DeeDee Member


    On the other hand, my house is So clean you can have your gall bladder removed in my kitchen. My house looks like nobody really lives here.

    My grandsons have inherited my love of housework. When my 6-year old grandson was 2, he came though the front door of my new house for the first time, asking "Nana, where are my brooms?" 6 am the next morning (I NEVER get up that early) there he is at my bedside asking "Can I vacuum?" I gave him my Swiffer stick vac- the battery operated kind that you put the dry Swiffers on the bottom. It was a REAL vacuum, not a toy like his toy Dyson, and he looked at it lovingly- he said "I've been waiting all my life for a vacuum like this". All his life- all TWO YEARS of it!
    Now, my daughter makes them vacuum all the time, as his 3-year old brother also loves to clean. They also like to dust. And the love to shovel snow! When they are teens, they might not think it is fun anymore, so we have to make the most of it.
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